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Friend who has biased views on religion. (Discuss biased beliefs.)

Senpаi

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Dad Apprentice

Dad

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[quote name='~ P O L A R I S ~' timestamp='1311490184' post='5382601']
I have based views on religion.

[img]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Eae2pvqy8eM/TQP49QeEQ8I/AAAAAAAAADw/XEaQy9axajM/s1600/pic3.jpg[/img]
[/quote]

That was funny as s***. xD

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.Starrk Newbie

.Starrk

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[quote name='ADHD-Guitar' timestamp='1311542595' post='5384109']
I have no trouble admitting that I am biased against Pastafarianism. It's an insult to human intelligence and a generally weak argument. You'd make a better point by simply claiming that there is no tangible evidence that god(s) exist.
[/quote]

However the variable in the situation is how devoted he/she is, and how strong their will to act is on proving such a god exists. Along with intellect.

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Welche the crab Newbie

Welche the crab

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[quote name='ADHD-Guitar' timestamp='1311542595' post='5384109']
I have no trouble admitting that I am biased against Pastafarianism. It's an insult to human intelligence and a generally weak argument. You'd make a better point by simply claiming that there is no tangible evidence that god(s) exist.
[/quote]

Ok I am just offended now. How would you feel if someone told you that Christianity is an insult to human intelligence? You would make a better point saying God exists because he obviously does. Please stop being so retarded and think about others before making insulting comments like that.

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Hydra of Ages Newbie

Hydra of Ages

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[quote name='Ghost Origins' timestamp='1311483402' post='5382408']
That's my point. This is exactly why I'm tired of hearing the extremist s***. "CHRISTIANS FORCE THEIR BELIEFS DOWN YOUR THROAT." "[b]BELIEVE IN GOD OR BE PUNISHED[/b]."

Bzzzt. Wrong. Cuz if God wanted everyone to believe in Him no matter what circumstance, we wouldn't have free will. Yes, He asked us to spread the word about Him, what he did, etc. But He did not absolutely, 100% COMMAND us to make others believe in Him. It even says in the Bible, that others won't believe. It depicts Atheism, Agnosticism, etc.

I've got an Atheist friend who I asked to go to Chruch with me once (just cuz a Youth Pastor challenged me). He did go to say the least. When service was over and he looked at me and went, "You know I still don't believe in God right?"

I replied," Yeah. Didn't think you would. But thanks for not treating me like a stranger."

He goes and tells me, "I kinda like this whole religion thing in certain aspects, but it ain't right for me."

I say to him, "Cool. So football tomorrow?"

Still friends to this day. Simply put, to each his own. I found my way to Christ based on my belief (not fact). So if others find their way through me, I'm happy. If not, then so what? All I can do is say I tried to do what my Father asked. It ain't my place to MAKE you a Christian.
[/quote]

Except that's exactly what ends up happening.

I'm not completely set against religion, but Christianity in particular bugs me on that one piece. Yeah, we have free will, but it turns out the 'free' part is actually a choice between [b](1)[/b] Do whatever I say forever, or [b](2)[/b] Burn in constant agony for all eternity- that's really not much of a choice.

Of course, I know you were just saying that not all Christians are extremists. And they aren't; there are bad eggs in every bunch, like everything else, but as a whole you can't really stereotype the entire group. That said, there are a certain amount of them who use their religion as a soapbox, which is always annoying.

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Vough Newbie

Vough

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[quote name='Hydra of Thunder' timestamp='1311702872' post='5388889']
Except that's exactly what ends up happening.

I'm not completely set against religion, but Christianity in particular bugs me on that one piece. Yeah, we have free will, but it turns out the 'free' part is actually a choice between [b](1)[/b] Do whatever I say forever, or [b](2)[/b] Burn in constant agony for all eternity- that's really not much of a choice.

Of course, I know you were just saying that not all Christians are extremists. And they aren't; there are bad eggs in every bunch, like everything else, but as a whole you can't really stereotype the entire group. That said, there are a certain amount of them who use their religion as a soapbox, which is always annoying.
[/quote]

I hate it when people take things out of context and insert their own ideas >.<

Christianity does not mean that you enslave your whole life to following God. It does not means you do whatever He says, whatever He wants, etc. You still live your life. Nothing will have changed if you were living a decent lifestyle, except that you believe in a God.

I don't know why everyone brings up that Christians literally say, "OR YOU'LL BURN IN HELL FOREVER" because that's just stupid, and that's as close as forcing your religion as it can get. If anyone bases an argument around that, then they are stupid.

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Dark Newbie

Dark

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[s]Someone should calculate the total elapsed time an eighty-year-old Christian has spent in their entire lifetime devoting actions to religion, and make a comparison as to what they could have done to actually benefit society in that time.[/s]

[i]I have no trouble admitting that I am biased against Pastafarianism. It's an insult to human intelligence and a generally weak argument. You'd make a better point by simply claiming that there is no tangible evidence that god(s) exist.[/i]

I have no trouble admitting that I am biased against monotheistic religions. They're an insult to human intelligent and have generally weak arguments. You'd make a better point by simply claiming that the only god is a flying piece of food.

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Vough Newbie

Vough

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[quote name='Dark' timestamp='1311821928' post='5394026']
[s]Someone should calculate the total elapsed time an eighty-year-old Christian has spent in their entire lifetime devoting actions to religion, and make a comparison as to what they could have done to actually benefit society in that time.[/s]

[i]I have no trouble admitting that I am biased against Pastafarianism. It's an insult to human intelligence and a generally weak argument. You'd make a better point by simply claiming that there is no tangible evidence that god(s) exist.[/i]

I have no trouble admitting that I am biased against monotheistic religions. They're an insult to human intelligent and have generally weak arguments. You'd make a better point by simply claiming that the only god is a flying piece of food.
[/quote]

but...but...that IS PASTAFARIANISM!!!

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Yasu Newbie

Yasu

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[size=1]So bored[/size]
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/72/LynnHarveyNyborg-CountryBelieveGod-Intelligence.svg/400px-LynnHarveyNyborg-CountryBelieveGod-Intelligence.svg.png[/img] [img]http://www.godandscience.org/images/iqvsreligion.gif[/img]

So maybe it [b]is[/b] an insult to human intelligence.
[right][right][size=2][i]EDIT: OH NO I POSTED THIS W/ MY MAIN ACCOUNT.[/i][/size][/right][/right]

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Dark Newbie

Dark

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Man, the graph needs to have more points on it. Also, why does the IQ cap at 110? I'm sure results would be even more accurate if the y-axis extended up to like 140. :/

[i]If you wish to go to heaven then just accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your personal Saviour and Lord. That is the only way to go to heaven[/i]

Do I also have to do good deeds? I have to accept a drunk stoner as my Lord [b]and[/b] do good things? No thanks. D:<

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Shradow Newbie

Shradow

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I haven't usually been the kind of person to post in these sort of religious debates, but I think it best I start so I can easier get out my thoughts, as I am currently in the position of becoming one who's not so believing in God as my parents have tried to raise me to be.

Anyways, if one is so biased like your friend, then there's really no helping it, but it's things like VthisV that help me go against my possible bias despite my upbringing.

One, the free will thing. What kind of religion will place you in hell if you don't believe in their God, said God being the one who gave you the ability not to believe in him? If God's supposed to be benevolent, wouldn't he make it so we can't go against him so we wouldn't go to hell? Free will sounds like a gift, but what kind of gift has the potential to send us to hell?

Also, in the Bible it says that if a man lies with another man, it's an abomination. I'm pretty sure, for a lot of people, they don't really have a choice in the matter, and are born that way. Why would God allow people to be born gay if it goes against what's in the Bible?

And obviously, God or anything of the sort has never been proved by science or anything.

I'm just having a hard time finding a reason to believe in something like that, you know? I'm not biased based on my upbrining, and it's a shame not everyone has the chance to widen their views and have a chance to change to something based on their own findings and beliefs and not just on what they were made to grow up believing. I hope that makes sense.

Goodness me, if my grandparents read this I would be in so much trouble...

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Dark Newbie

Dark

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[quote name='Vough' timestamp='1312441440' post='5412613']

No you don't.
Drunk Stoner? What?
[/quote]

So as long as I believe in your god, I don't have to do good deeds and I still get a free pass to heaven? So I could, in essence, be a serial killer and merely [i]believe[/i] in your god and I get off scot-free? I simultaneously love and hate your religion, then.

And I called Jesus a drunk stoner, buddy. If it isn't obvious why, you're doing something wrong.

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Nathanael D. Striker Apprentice

Nathanael D. Striker

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[quote name='Dark' timestamp='1312591997' post='5418149']

So as long as I believe in your god, I don't have to do good deeds and I still get a free pass to heaven? So I could, in essence, be a serial killer and merely [i]believe[/i] in your god and I get off scot-free? I simultaneously love and hate your religion, then.

And I called Jesus a drunk stoner, buddy. If it isn't obvious why, you're doing something wrong.
[/quote]

I fund dat insoltn to my faih.

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Vough Newbie

Vough

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[quote name='Dark' timestamp='1312591997' post='5418149']

So as long as I believe in your god, I don't have to do good deeds and I still get a free pass to heaven? So I could, in essence, be a serial killer and merely [i]believe[/i] in your god and I get off scot-free? I simultaneously love and hate your religion, then.

And I called Jesus a drunk stoner, buddy. If it isn't obvious why, you're doing something wrong.
[/quote]

Do shizzle now, punishment later. You don't get off scot-free, you just don't get punished on Earth by God. You'd of course, probaly be executed on Earth, though.

Why are you calling Jesus a stoner?
Why are you calling Jesus drunk? He drank but not never became tipsy or drunk from it. I hope you are talking about Miror B.'s thought, because even then that is flawed.

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Dad Apprentice

Dad

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[quote name='Shradow' timestamp='1312180595' post='5403733']
I haven't usually been the kind of person to post in these sort of religious debates, but I think it best I start so I can easier get out my thoughts, as I am currently in the position of becoming one who's not so believing in God as my parents have tried to raise me to be.

Anyways, if one is so biased like your friend, then there's really no helping it, but it's things like VthisV that help me go against my possible bias despite my upbringing.

One, the free will thing. What kind of religion will place you in hell if you don't believe in their God, said God being the one who gave you the ability not to believe in him? If God's supposed to be benevolent, wouldn't he make it so we can't go against him so we wouldn't go to hell? Free will sounds like a gift, but what kind of gift has the potential to send us to hell?

[b]Believing in God is one thing. But trusting in Him is another. You can't get out of hell just for believing in Him. To establish a relationship with God you have to give it your all. It's a commitment, not a buy one get one free. I understand your point, but I'm saying this: Most laws say you can't drink until 21. Why expose the community under 21 to alcohol if we're not legal to drink it? Get what I'm saying?[/b]

Also, in the Bible it says that if a man lies with another man, it's an abomination. I'm pretty sure, for a lot of people, they don't really have a choice in the matter, and are born that way. Why would God allow people to be born gay if it goes against what's in the Bible?

And obviously, God or anything of the sort has never been proved by science or anything.

[b]If God could be found by science, there would be no point in religion / faith / or beliefs.[/b]

I'm just having a hard time finding a reason to believe in something like that, you know?

[b]Logic is the breaking point of BELIEFS. Notice I said beliefs and not facts. It's tough to commit to something like the Christian faith without having anything to back it up excluding personal experience. (inb4coincindences)[/b]

I'm not biased based on my upbrining, and it's a shame not everyone has the chance to widen their views and have a chance to change to something based on their own findings and beliefs and not just on what they were made to grow up believing.

[b]Some parents are stupid. It's those same parents who will tell you to convert or die (again, that's a lie. It's not in the Bible). But we can't change people. People have to change themselves, as you did. It's nature right? The only thing is, I have a different perspective and view. I don't find it reasonable to say that everything that ever has come into existence, since the Big Bang Theory, before the Big Bang, etc, all happened by mere chance. I don't believe everything just HAPPENED. BUT, I don't deny the truths of science either.[/b]

I hope that makes sense.

[b]Cheah, cheah.[/b]

Goodness me, if my grandparents read this I would be in so much trouble...

[b]I KNOW THAT FEELING. O.O[/b]
[/quote]

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Dr. Cakey Newbie

Dr. Cakey

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I activate Elemental Hero Debateman's [i]super power[/i]! Quote block!

[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1310449795' post='5347223']
@Maghion: Scholars cannot deny the facts that Jesus did live 2,000 years ago. the only question is if he was risen from the dead. You may think it is harsh, but there are many opportunities in a lifetime.
[/quote]
The primary source indicating the existence of Jesus was the history of the Jews recorded by Flavius Josephus. However, his text was written a long time after the death of Jesus and he received biased information. It is probable that Jesus existed - why would a sect make up a name for its founder? Actually, it's even probable that he was crucified - Pontius Pilate is recorded as having executed thousands of people yearly. The real point, though, is that it doesn't matter if the person creating a sect of Judaism was named Jesus or not.

[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1310435177' post='5346804']
The fact is, hell was intended for Satan and his followers.[/quote]
Okay, now that is demonstrably incorrect. Satan is a fusion of two separate Old Testament concepts: 1) The Tempter, one of God's angels (not a fallen angel, but an active member of God's 'court' or whatever it would be called (you get to meet him in the story of Job, though most modern Christians will insist the Tempter is the Devil)), and 2) Any god that is not the God of Abraham. Satan just means 'adversary' or 'enemy'.

There is the medieval story concerning Lucifer, of course.

[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1310435177' post='5346804']Unfortunately for great deal, not accepting it gives hell. Those who hear about Jesus, but don't act are guilty.[/quote]
Well, I have two points. The first is, suppose I hear about Jesus, but only from Jehovah's Witnesses? Do I get an exemption?

Second, and more importantly, look at what you just said. "Unfortunately". Isn't that an interesting way to put it? Pretty clumsy system, don't you think. Now, I know that I'm just a fly trying to understand the vast masterpiece of God's tapestry or whatever, but...well, as long as Tom gets put on the right part of the planet, and hears about Christianity from a charismatic enough source, doesn't have a midlife crisis, and doesn't get into any of that psycho Buddhist stuff, he'll be a lock for heaven.

Opinion =/= Being right

[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1310435177' post='5346804']
@Everyone: Has anyone read "The Case for Christ"? If not, I suggest giving it a read.
[/quote]
It's on my 'to [s]lol at[/s] read' list.

[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1310840022' post='5360749']
A little history lesson. Jews were the first Christians. Got to love that.
[/quote]
From a certain incorrect perspective, yes, they [s]were[/s] are.

[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1310842069' post='5360836']
Jesus was raised in a Jewish family. That is correct, but Jesus is the Son of God. Like I said, Jews were the first Christians.
[/quote]
And as the Son of God, he is the son of the God of the Jews. Hard to get more Jewish than that.

[quote name='Hydra of Thunder' timestamp='1310879233' post='5362162']
Except Jahova and Yaweh aren't anything. They're just slightly different ways of pronouncing "Yhwh", the actual name of God, since that word doesn't have any vowels in it. "Allah" is literally just arabic for "god", and if I spoke arabic and was also a Christian, I'd STILL call God "Allah".

The fact that the religions believe in slightly different sets of religious texts (keep in mind that all three of them believe in most of the Old Testament, so there's at least one commonality) is nonmaterial, they're still worshiping the same God. By your logic, Catholics and Protestants worship different Gods too, as does anyone else who interprets the Bible in a slightly different way.
[/quote]
[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1310935481' post='5363758']
Jews didn't accept Jesus even though he fulfilled all the prophecies concerning the Messiah. Christians do however. Muslims, well I don't want to go there. In my stand point, they are a tad misinformed.
[/quote]
The two basic things that the Messiah would do were 1) create miracles, particularly miracles of healing, and 2) establish God's Kingdom, presumably on earth. Countless people have created miracles, or at least claimed to (some of them with shocking amounts of evidence). No one has established God's Kingdom on earth. And seeing as the kingdom has always been described as a physical kingdom, it would be reasonable to assume that [i]that's what it would be[/i].

Ah, also, the Messiah would be of the line of King David. Even the gospels do not seem convinced that Jesus is of the line of David, but that's something that we don't need to get into, because, quite frankly, if such a bloodline still existed at that point (or still exists), there would be/are thousands of people of that line.

[quote name='Ghost Origins' timestamp='1311482621' post='5382380']
It's funny because as a Christian I believe God gave us all free will, and that's why He asked us (Christians) to spread the word. Also, I don't know where in the Bible it says "MAKE PEOPLE BELIEVE IN ME".

Anyone?
[/quote]
Well, I thought I was going to have to take a peek into the gospels, but Mr. Striker helpfully gave me a quote:

'Matthew 28:19, "So you must go and make disciples of all nations. Baptize them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit."'

[quote name='Mr. Striker' timestamp='1312154129' post='5402837']
[url="http://bible-studies.cephasministry.com/what_is_heaven_like.html"]Please don't kill me.[/url]
[/quote]
Sounds pretty awful to me.

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