[DISC] Decision of Sorrow

[CrabHelmet]

Decision of Sorrow

[Normal Spell]

Select 5 cards from your Deck and show them to your opponent. Your opponent selects 1 card among them. Place that card on top of your Deck, and remove the remaining cards from play.

 

Discuss where it would belong on the list if it existed.

[Abstract [Atrocity]]

banned

 

the top of the deck thing's a little perk, dumping 4 is the main point.

3x Mezuki, plaguespreaders, quillbolts, ect?

not even close

[The Dark One]

3x wulf 2x gardna.

 

Mill whatever you put on top in the end phase with whatever lightsworn you happen to have on the field.

 

Definitely banned, it's just a slightly less cheap version of Painful choice.

[Guest PikaPerson01]

Too many perfectly legal cards gain there effects while in the graveyard.

 

Dasher, Malicious, Mezuki, Plaguespreader Zombie, Wulf, Necro Gardna... uhh... Shield Warrior? And so on.

 

It was more it's 4x Foolish Burial effect that got Painful Choice banned then anything.

[CrabHelmet]

every1 seems 2 assume u hav burial in ur hand alredee

[Guest Chaos Pudding]

Banned, for the reasons everyone else has already stated.

 

Now, if it was something like this...

 

Annoying Verdict

Normal Spell

Select 5 cards from your Deck and show them to your opponent. Your opponent selects 1 of those cards. Shuffle the other 4 back into your Deck, and place the selected card on the top of your Deck.

 

I'm not sure about that one...

 

EDIT: I see that salty changed the card effect on me...

 

Without BftDD/RftDD/Dimension Fusion, it doesn't really have the ability to set up much. I feel, at this moment, it probably is ok at 3.

[Abstract [Atrocity]]

the new one's beter at 3 >>

not much you can do with it except set up for some returns, maybe get 2x Necroface out or some scout planes, but not as bad as the previously uneditted one >>

 

the edit button was designed to make us look like idiots 4 sh*ts and g*ggles

[Guest PikaPerson01]

(This post was last modified: Today 03:27 PM by Crab Helmet.)

 

Oh, you changed the effect.

 

Macro decks would have more to play with. Where would Necroface fall on the banlist?

[GenzoTheHarpist]

Would be fine at three IMO.

[CrabHelmet]

Where would Necroface fall on the banlist?

 

I usually put it at 1, because its self-mill effect combos with other copies of itself, and removing 15 cards from both decks from play seems like too large a reward for something as simple as removing one of your own cards from play. Plus, from there, it isn't terribly hard to cause deckouts by un-removing and re-removing the Necrofaces. And Inferno Tempest just complicates matters.

[Bakura Vessal]

Defenetly ban.

 

Thins your deck, for Exodia. (Also incase your wondering, why I always go on this stuff with Exodia, it's because it's one of the only decks I use.)

 

EDIT: Then again, their is the Toon Table of Content combo, which thins your deck out just as much, if your using it with a toon monster.

 

But this at least has to be at 1 (any more and you pwn your opponant too quickly)

[Megaworm]

Limited.

 

RingFP isn't too harsh as simply dumping crap into the graveyard. When it's removed from play it can't do much of anything unless it's dedicated mortally to being removed from play.

 

And the though is, besides RingFP cards from your deck, what would you use this card for?

[tonisanoob]

im sayign ban, but thn in a good format all the stuff you woudl normally top deck, woudl be B& thn thn again in a good ormat maybe, this format no, but as we can only go on this format this card shoudl stay banned

[CrabHelmet]

I can barely read the gibberish that tonisanoob has just posted, but I think I saw something about the current meta being the deciding factor in all banlist decisions, which proves that after five thousand posts he has learned absolutely nothing.

[tonisanoob]

¬_¬, well okay thn, explain how using a "good meta" as an example of wether cards shoud be banned or not is a good way of determing if they are broken or not, as we only have 1 meta and that is the current meta >.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

I say ban it in this format. In a balanced format, I have no idea where it would go.

 

Can make big combos, and it also thins the deck in the process.

[CrabHelmet]

¬_¬' date=' well okay thn, explain how using a "good meta" as an example of wether cards shoud be banned or not is a good way of determing if they are broken or not, as we only have 1 meta and that is the current meta >.<

[/quote']

 

Changing the banlist changes the meta. Hence, changing the banlist based upon the current meta produces a lagged banlist that is always acting one format too slow. The banlist should be constructed to account not for what the meta is but for what the meta will be once the changes are complete.

 

That's why phrases like "I say ban it in this format" are stupid; if you alter the banlist, you alter the format, so we are no longer in "this format", making the phrase moot. In this format, it is always unlimited; otherwise, it is not this format.

[tonisanoob]

hmm see i dodnt think that is the case, by addign 1 card to see how it woudl effect the format it is not changing the format per-se

 

we shoudl only use the curent format to measue the brokenness of cards in my oppinion as frankly we have nothgin else to go on

 

i sey that we shoudl see wether a card is op'ed, by seeign how it woudl effect our current meta, by addign 1 card it dosnt change out meta i think your beign rather extreme, by sayign it does

[「tea.leaf」]

I only see this helping Macro, primarily by dumping Scouts and Kuraz.

 

I don't think this thinning is much help anywhere else. > >

[Guest PikaPerson01]

On a completely unrelated note, the URL of this topic is:

 

http://forum.yugiohcardmaker.net/thread-90000.html

 

That's an awesome number.

[~/Coolio Prime\~]

What happens to the selected cards while Imperial Iron Wall is in play?

[CrabHelmet]

hmm see i dodnt think that is the case' date=' by addign 1 card to see how it woudl effect the format it is not changing the format per-se

 

we shoudl only use the curent format to measue the brokenness of cards in my oppinion as frankly we have nothgin else to go on

 

i sey that we shoudl see wether a card is op'ed, by seeign how it woudl effect our current meta, by addign 1 card it dosnt change out meta i think your beign rather extreme, by sayign it does

[/quote']

 

If you honestly have "nothing else to go on", then I must presume that your brain has ceased to function and only your eyes remain. Common sense and extrapolation are key. If you can use them, then you need not rely on the current meta; if you cannot use them, then you have nothing to contribute.

 

The current meta also produces visibly misleading results. Starting from the current meta, the single change of placing one of the following cards at 3 would be extremely unlikely to cause problems:

 

Card Destruction

Chain Strike

Cyber Dragon

Giant Trunade

Gold Sarcophagus

Magic Cylinder

Marshmallon

Megamorph

Mirage of Nightmare

Mirror Force

Necroface

Thousand-Eyes Restrict

Time Seal

Trap Dustshoot

Treeborn Frog

Tribe-Infecting Virus

Tsukuyomi

Ultimate Offering

Victory Dragon

 

That doesn't mean that these cards should all be placed at 3. The problem is that problem cards like Treeborn Frog are overshadowed by even more problematic cards like Dark Armed Dragon and Crush Card Virus; limitless free tribute fodder is a problem, but it's not as big a problem as DAD and CCV are.

 

Here we see the problem with using the current meta as a model: a banlist that accounts solely for whatever happens to be already bashing the game's metaphorical ribs to pieces a club fails to account for the other problems that are holding a sixteen-ton weight over the game's equally metaphorical head but which cannot drop it yet because some guy with a club is in the way. The banlist responds eternally in lag, and hence nothing is dealt with until it is too late and it has already destroyed the game. Any sensible system of banlist construction does not force the game to be ruined in this manner; it defeats the very purpose of the banlist.

 

What happens to the selected cards while Imperial Iron Wall is in play?

 

This card cannot be activated if Imperial Iron Wall is already active. If Imperial Iron Wall is chained to this card, the other four cards are shuffled into the deck before the fifth card is placed on top.

[Tabris]

Give some time and a designer jabroniy enough to try make the RFG zone into a second Grave, and this is banworthy.

 

Needless to say, this goes the way o' Painful.

[「tea.leaf」]

Dimensional Alchemist?