tpho Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 EDIT: Problem solved, if I don't draw a mirror force, torrential tribute, or any other card. well sheet happens.NO MOAR POSTS PLEASE, topic is getting out of hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orochi Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 insect imitation?? dude, play with real opponents... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 InsectsCydraSixSamDinosaurs Can't think of any others.but' date=' yea i really hate it when someone abuses an insect imitation.[/quote'] Yeah, getting swarmed hurts. Not sure what you mean by Insect Imitation Abuse. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShinobiDark72 Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 You forgot:BatterymenLightsworns Frogs(yes, there is actually somewhat of a swarm tacit to Frogs.) And yes, getting swarmed is annoying, swarming someone else is too much fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fh-Fh Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Gigaplant? Where's Gigaplant? And Dinosaurs? Who do you play with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pharaoh_Atem Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Welcome to YGO. If you don't like it, stop saying that sheet like "Torrential Tribute" is "too powerful", and that "Scapegoat" should stay where it is. It's dumbassed whining about cards like those two... that got Swarm to where it is at the moment, obviously. Coincedentally, this format's lack of difficulty is EXACTLY why it is 1) easier to swarm, and 2) easier to win with worse decks. That easy swarm, combined with the worse decks' jump in viability, permit the game's bad players to think that this is a "good" format. The thing is, a "good" format is defined by bad players LOSING more often than they do now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpho Posted June 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Ok you need to relax. Every post i come to, i see you flaming someone. 1) When did i say torrential tribute is too powerful? and where did scapegoat come out of my post? 2) shadowninja's view on it is exactly how i see it. 3) Insect imitation - Opponent swarms the field with level 4-6 insects and then boosts them with insect imitation, creating a bunch of insects on steroids. Not really abusing but it does get annoying to be against 3 2500+ attack insects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orochi Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 and no chances of using mirror force, waboku or lightning vortex the next turn?? also, how you allow that he swarms with high level monsters, then turning ONE into an insect on rush?? really, play better opponets or get a better deck... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyhe Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 InsectsCydraSixSamDinosaurs Can't think of any others.but' date=' yea i really hate it when someone abuses an insect imitation.[/quote']Let's not forget about our dear beloved Zombies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-Max Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Swarm means Beatdown right? I have to admit I enjoy the challenge of a Beatdown because they may get too Cocky and I slip in a Mirror Force or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyhe Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Swarm means Beatdown right? I have to admit I enjoy the challenge of a Beatdown because they may get too Cocky and I slip in a Mirror Force or something.Actually,swarming refers to mass summoning of monsters.Zombies,Lightsworns & 6Sams are designed for such purposes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JesusofChaos™ Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 God people, if someone swarms you, they have outplayed you. Gain experience from it and learn from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpho Posted June 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Yes, but the chances of a mirror force is very low. Not every duel i am going to draw a mirror force on the first turn. Anyways, it is easier said than done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kizzi Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I run an Insect Swarm and a Tomato Plant thing, so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iAmNateXero Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 swarming is just another win condition, so i cant see why people dont liek it? Actualy its like the most popular win condition now... right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pharaoh_Atem Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Ok you need to relax. Every post i come to' date=' i see you flaming someone. [/quote'] 1) You're greatly misguided if you think I'm not already relaxed. The assumption that someone who degrades you *must* "need to relax" is a common assumption amongst overemotional people. Your problem is that you care too much about the internet to be in any place to tell anyone what to do - otherwise, you wouldn't be fool enough to make that assumption in the first place. 2) Flames are not facts. I state facts. Facts are often ugly and often piss off other people who don't want to hear them. Now, if I said something like "Your mother's a whore," I'd be flaming your mother - unless she actually is a whore, at which point I'd say that "the best state for her to live in would be Nevada." If I said something like "you're most likely bad at YGO", that wouldn't be a flame - it would be fact, supported by how you're complaining about decktypes that don't stand a bloody chance on any real levels of competition. When did i say torrential tribute is too powerful? You didn't. I never said you said anything of the sort. I never said that anyone in specific said anything of the sort' date=' aside from possibly implying that "bad players" have said such things in the past (thereby landing us in the crappy state we're in at the moment). It is of high likelihood that the majority of the players you play against HAVE indeed said such things, as the majority of players are bad players. You need to relearn some reading comprehension. For posterity's sake, here's what I did say. Welcome to YGO. If you don't like it, stop saying that s*** like "Torrential Tribute" is "too powerful", and that "Scapegoat" should stay where it is. It's dumbassed whining about cards like those two... that got Swarm to where it is at the moment, obviously. Coincedentally, this format's lack of difficulty is EXACTLY why it is 1) easier to swarm, and 2) easier to win with worse decks. That easy swarm, combined with the worse decks' jump in viability, permit the game's bad players to think that this is a "good" format. The thing is, a "good" format is defined by bad players LOSING more often than they do now. and where did scapegoat come out of my post? It didn't. I never said it did anything of the sort. Again' date=' reading comprehension - use it. God people, if someone swarms you, they have outplayed you. See, this is exactly what I was talking about - folks always prefer to think that they "outplayed" the opponent, instead of having won solely out of either luck, flaws of the format, or a combination of both. You're honestly an idiot to make such a blanket statement. Several of this format's top techniques involve swarming; all of those techniques are effortless. It takes no "ability to outplay" to Special Summon a Secutor and then use its effect to fill your field. It takes no "ability to outplay" to Summon Gyzarus, and then use its effect to fill your field. It takes no "ability to outplay" to summon 2-3x JD; Lumina can cover easy backup w/ 1 NS. It takes no "ability to outplay" to summon DAD alongside other DARK monsters. You don't need to outplay anyone in order to swarm. All you need to do is summon a number of monsters and keep them all alive long enough to kill the opp. That's not difficult. That's not outplaying. The ONLY time that swarming could ever qualify as "outplaying" would be a time wherein it is actually difficult. It is not difficult, ergo, you are wrong. I have to admit I enjoy the challenge of a Beatdown because they may get too Cocky and I slip in a Mirror Force or something. You "enjoy the (nonexistent) challenge" of a Beatdown because your opponent might be enough of a dumbass to lose a high number of monsters to your Mirror Force? swarming is just another win condition' date=' so i cant see why people dont liek it?[/quote'] People obviously like it. No, swarming is not a Win Condition, otherwise, the rulebook would say so. Swarming is the means to an end; it gets you TO a Win Condition. Win Conditions are only problematic when they are easy; when it's easy to win, there's no way to prevent bad players from winning at a higher rate. When swarming is easy, it becomes easy to get to a Win Condition. Bad players can only win often when it is easy to get to a Win Condition. Good players can win when it is more difficult. Namely, the game should be difficult solely for the sake of making sure it is the better player that wins. Actualy its like the most popular win condition now... right? As said before, it is not a win condition, but the way to a win condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azuh Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 USE IT MOAR! XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exiro Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Well, it feels pretty stupid if you have to deal with a bunch of monsters and don't have the right card(s) for the situation, but you can at least side some Lightning Vortexes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iAmNateXero Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 No' date=' swarming is not a Win Condition, otherwise, the rulebook would say so.[/b'] What? Just because its not in the rule book makes it not a win condition? So does that exclude Victory dragon, Final count down, F.I.N.A.L., OTK's, and FTK's? None of them are in the rule book, but you can clearly find Reducing an oponents life points to 0 is a win condition, and swarming clearly covers that. (Good swarming anyway.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exiro Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 No' date=' swarming is not a Win Condition, otherwise, the rulebook would say so.[/b'] What? Just because its not in the rule book makes it not a win condition? So does that exclude Victory dragon, Final count down, F.I.N.A.L., OTK's, and FTK's? None of them are in the rule book, but you can clearly find Reducing an oponents life points to 0 is a win condition, and swarming clearly covers that. (Good swarming anyway.) You didn't agree with him.Fear the judgment of his 5-10 paragraphs of writing that prove him correct :\ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pharaoh_Atem Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 No' date=' swarming is not a Win Condition, otherwise, the rulebook would say so.[/b'] What? Just because its not in the rule book makes it not a win condition? So does that exclude Victory dragon, Final count down, F.I.N.A.L., OTK's, and FTK's? None of them are in the rule book, but you can clearly find Reducing an oponents life points to 0 is a win condition, and swarming clearly covers that. (Good swarming anyway.) You didn't agree with him.Fear the judgment of his 5-10 paragraphs of writing that prove him correct :\ Nah - a little less than that. It's only because he's so amazingly dense, though, that he makes it easy enough to take care of his nonsense in less than the usual amount. http://entertainment.upperdeck.com/yugioh/en/gameplay/rulebook/rulebook_v06_EN.pdf Page 22 has a subsection called "Winning a Duel". It reads as follows, and also has a list of Victory Conditions. Each player starts a Duel with 8000 Life Points. You win a Duel if: you reduce your opponent's Life Points to 0; your opponent is unable to draw a card; or if a card's special effect says you win. If you and your opponent both reach 0 Life Points at the same time' date=' the Duel is declared a DRAW.[/quote'] Reduce your opponent's Life Points to 0.Your opponent is unable to draw a card when they are supposed to draw.Win with a card's special effect. The Terms "Win Condition" and "Victory Condition" are interchangable. Now, then, let's read what I said. No' date=' swarming is not a Win Condition, otherwise, the rulebook would say so.[/quote'] Now, does assembling a swarm mean that the opponent's LPs are at 0? Does it mean that the opponent cannot draw? Does it mean that a special effect is set off that says "you win"? No. Now, let's look at what you said What? Just because its not in the rule book makes it not a win condition? Yes None of them are in the rule book' date='[/quote'] That's because they are cards and/or tactics that approach Win Conditions. They are not Win Conditions; they are how you GET to Win Conditions. If a Win Condition were Disney World, an OTK would not be Disney World. It would be the car you drive in order to get to Disney World. but you can clearly find Reducing an oponents life points to 0 is a win condition' date='[/quote'] Duh and swarming clearly covers that. (Good swarming anyway.) No' date=' not in the way you say it does. It's the way to a win condition. It is not a win condition. There is a difference. Here's what you said: What? Just because its not in the rule book makes it not a win condition? So does that exclude Victory dragon, Final count down, F.I.N.A.L., OTK's, and FTK's? None of them are in the rule book, but you can clearly find Reducing an oponents life points to 0 is a win condition, and swarming clearly covers that. (Good swarming anyway.) And here's what the meaning of what you said is: Swarming is a win condition because it lets you achieve a win condition. OTKs and FTKs are win conditions because they let you achieve win conditions. VD' date=' FC, and DB are win conditions because they let you achieve win conditions.[/quote'] See how the meaning of what you said -just-so-happens- to sound amazingly stupid and wrong? That's because, frankly, it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyber Altair Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 gosh Atem, you do have a lot of time on your hand lol. Anyway i'm usually the one who swarms. Anyway if your deck loses against a deck just because he has more cards on the field then your deck is either bad or really bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pharaoh_Atem Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 gosh Atem' date=' you do have a lot of time on your hand lol. Anyway i'm usually the one who swarms. Anyway if your deck loses against a deck just because he has more cards on the field then your deck is either bad or really bad.[/quote'] Eh, it only took about three or four mins. Also, that blanket statement you made about other peoples' decks... way off, man. Players never lose "just because the opponent has more cards on the field," ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exiro Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 No' date=' swarming is not a Win Condition, otherwise, the rulebook would say so.[/b'] What? Just because its not in the rule book makes it not a win condition? So does that exclude Victory dragon, Final count down, F.I.N.A.L., OTK's, and FTK's? None of them are in the rule book, but you can clearly find Reducing an oponents life points to 0 is a win condition, and swarming clearly covers that. (Good swarming anyway.) You didn't agree with him.Fear the judgment of his 5-10 paragraphs of writing that prove him correct :\ Nah - a little less than that. It's only because he's so amazingly dense, though, that he makes it easy enough to take care of his nonsense in less than the usual amount. I thought that when a line of text is made after a line that doesn't include text, it's a new paragraph is entered. If that's true, your post includes 17 paragraphs with the quotes excluded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pharaoh_Atem Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 That's not necessarily when a new paragraph is made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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