Pull out of the UK [Emergency petition]

[cr47t]

Petition for YCM to cease operations in the United Kingdom

What is this post about?

The United Kingdom parliament has passed a new bill which is on track to become law soon, that under the guise of 'protecting children' would allow the UK government to permit intrusion and scanning of entire websites for "child abuse content" as the powers that be define it (even if not accurate). This includes encryption backdoors for private messages, and also is written to impact sites even if they are not legally based under UK jurisdiction.

Now, I don't live in the UK or even read the news all that much (because of things like this), and it's late where I am, so I can't speak with authority on the bill's contents and ramifications in detail. This video, which is how I was informed of the situation, is something I think covers this situation, and why it's bad, fairly well. (It is not meant to be a substitute to this post.)

If you don't think there's actually going to be an enforcement attempt (even if just under the tories) or that the extent of the law's reach (the "means") is 'justified' by the stated intent of the bill (the "end(s)", assuming they're legitimate concerns and not a cover for control grab) - I can't help you. (Tip: If people make such an "ends justify the means" argument post in reply posts, however veiled or rational - do not engage with them.)

Summary article by TechCrunch, if you find the video too long or too outraged

How does this affect the card maker and site?

The reasons this affects YCM (and spinoff sites) can be summed up in five words of falsehood: "cartoons/comics/etc. are just for kids". Since this site is basically built on the Yu-Gi-Oh! card game, which is based on an anime series (Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters), which is in turn a spinoff of another anime/manga series (the anime version of such often nicknamed "Season Zero"), it is quite likely that this site, if brought to the attention of the UK gov't, would consider this a 'childrens site' (never mind the state of Yu-Gi-Oh today, or the forum base) and thus come at us and you with full force. (Again, if someone argues the five words have any substance, do not engage.)

This is also likely to be exasperated by the card maker's current generative AI, which is documented to be capable of producing NSFW results. This is an added risk, since someone could easily take that kind of thing being possible, and combine it with the five words of falsehood above to wade into the site. This is despite the fact that YCMaker has said he is open to looking into other AIs which have since launched when posting in the original no AI thread. (That being said, this is not an AI thread, so please keep your posts on such topics in the appropriate existing threads, not this one.)

What is a solution to this problem that YCM is capable of doing?

As far as I know, the only way for YCM to protect their users from this is to block the forum and AI in the card maker, if not the site as a whole, from use in the United Kingdom. This post is a petition for YCMaker either to officially do so with Yugioh Card Maker website, or to find a different solution to this scenario: if you agree, please like this post and tag the admins listed below in your own reply, as it appears for the time being that the UK enforcers will require either submission to all demands empowered by this law or withdrawal from the country, with no third option. I understand that withdrawal is not by any means an ideal solution, but as long as this thing and any like it are in place in the free world, this site must respond: services like WhatsApp have already pledged to withdraw from UK if the bill becomes law.

This thread is not a place for flaming, digressions from the topic of this original thread post, 'walls of text', etc. as these have caused the stalling of previously mentioned YCM issues in the past. I have contacted forum moderators and asked them to keep an eye on this thread.

There is possibility, however unlikely, that UK will allow a third option; or that they won't but Parliament/PM office will kick the tories out of majority rule and repeal the law, or at least scale it way down to the point where it is not a threat - but there's no guarantee. Alternatively, there's a chance that neither of those things happen but either YCMaker or the site's provider does not withdraw. I have created this petition to avoid such a worst case scenario, but ultimately, that is their choice, and this is mine: If this bill becomes law, then for as long as it is in enforceable effect and YCM hasn't signaled to us a pullout, I will not be using YCM's forums or its card maker.

(I am also requesting, on the side, that the option for users to manually delete their accounts will be reinstated, like in the forum's early days with the store, just in case worst comes to worst.)

@YCMaker @Falling Pizza @Flame Dragon

EDIT LOG

9/25/2023 - Reworded the request of the petition in consideration of British YCM forum veterans such as British Soul below

10/6/2023 - Clarity edits

11/13/2023 - It appears the bill is now law, posted an article in a reply here. IIRC it says full effects will wait until 2026 but the spy clause is part of the law now. Whether it's enforceable remains to be seen but I still think

Edited November 13, 2023 by cr47t
see edit log

[Zamazenta the OS-Tan Fan]

Yeah who are they to boss around people. Those Mother F***ers Governments are using the oldest excuse in the Book period. >:( makes me mad Governments are stupid and dumb they would love to fly a drone over everyone house to check on people but yet when the Government is caught doing Gross shit they flip out and have a meltdown and pin it on their own citizens like WTF Man!

The FBI and Playpen comes to mind you might the only reason I know this was because of Matuhar Video on it he is called Someordianrygamers on YouTube, Yeah I also watch Optuismist sometimes.

[Red Astral Qwipling]

So don't engage to people that actually contradicts your correct ideas? Lol. Keep dreaming.

 

In the unlikely event that YCM is blocked on UK, Just use a VPN. Good luck to UK on trying to enforce this unenforceable law. Anyone with money can challenge this law in UK courts once it's up and running. Site owners and mods can simply self-regulate, as what is happening here.

Edited September 22, 2023 by Red Astral Qwipling

[Horu]

I think the UK tried some stuff like this concerning nudity in anime/manga once before except the case was effectively thrown out by the judge who stated something along the lines of "anime/manga characters are entirely fictional and real world laws do not apply to fantasy".

As for a website like YCM, I don't see much impact due to the inherent nature of the site being a community brought together by our love for the game itself and we welcome anyone into a friendly and open environment where they can make cards, learn new strategies, make friends, and actually enjoy a not so toxic side of YGO.

[~British Soul~]

I know this is me being biased, but I hope YCM doesn't cease operations in the UK, on the other hand it'd be sad if my time on this site was essentially put to an end by the fucking Tories.

On a serious note, I'm not a fan of this law (which as far as I know is on its away to receiving royal assent) considering the ramifications it could have regarding privacy and whatnot, and of course regarding end-to-end encryption, something that has concerned messaging services like WhatsApp, from what I've read, the Government has said the bill doesn't ban end-to-end encrpytion.

[cr47t]

I know I'm late for this, but the UK bill has been signed off by King Charles III in accordance with the law of the land.

https://www.theregister.com/2023/10/27/online_safety_act_charles/

Although, the article says the bill will not be in complete effect until (after?) 2026 - but the spy clause is still intact.

[-GalexyVoids-]

On 9/21/2023 at 7:51 PM, cr47t said:

Petition for YCM to cease operations in the United Kingdom

What is this post about?

The United Kingdom parliament has passed a new bill which is on track to become law soon, that under the guise of 'protecting children' would allow the UK government to permit intrusion and scanning of entire websites for "child abuse content" as the powers that be define it (even if not accurate). This includes encryption backdoors for private messages, and also is written to impact sites even if they are not legally based under UK jurisdiction.

Now, I don't live in the UK or even read the news all that much (because of things like this), and it's late where I am, so I can't speak with authority on the bill's contents and ramifications in detail. This video, which is how I was informed of the situation, is something I think covers this situation, and why it's bad, fairly well. (It is not meant to be a substitute to this post.)

If you don't think there's actually going to be an enforcement attempt (even if just under the tories) or that the extent of the law's reach (the "means") is 'justified' by the stated intent of the bill (the "end(s)", assuming they're legitimate concerns and not a cover for control grab) - I can't help you. (Tip: If people make such an "ends justify the means" argument post in reply posts, however veiled or rational - do not engage with them.)

Summary article by TechCrunch, if you find the video too long or too outraged

How does this affect the card maker and site?

The reasons this affects YCM (and spinoff sites) can be summed up in five words of falsehood: "cartoons/comics/etc. are just for kids". Since this site is basically built on the Yu-Gi-Oh! card game, which is based on an anime series (Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters), which is in turn a spinoff of another anime/manga series (the anime version of such often nicknamed "Season Zero"), it is quite likely that this site, if brought to the attention of the UK gov't, would consider this a 'childrens site' (never mind the state of Yu-Gi-Oh today, or the forum base) and thus come at us and you with full force. (Again, if someone argues the five words have any substance, do not engage.)

This is also likely to be exasperated by the card maker's current generative AI, which is documented to be capable of producing NSFW results. This is an added risk, since someone could easily take that kind of thing being possible, and combine it with the five words of falsehood above to wade into the site. This is despite the fact that YCMaker has said he is open to looking into other AIs which have since launched when posting in the original no AI thread. (That being said, this is not an AI thread, so please keep your posts on such topics in the appropriate existing threads, not this one.)

What is a solution to this problem that YCM is capable of doing?

As far as I know, the only way for YCM to protect their users from this is to block the forum and AI in the card maker, if not the site as a whole, from use in the United Kingdom. This post is a petition for YCMaker either to officially do so with Yugioh Card Maker website, or to find a different solution to this scenario: if you agree, please like this post and tag the admins listed below in your own reply, as it appears for the time being that the UK enforcers will require either submission to all demands empowered by this law or withdrawal from the country, with no third option. I understand that withdrawal is not by any means an ideal solution, but as long as this thing and any like it are in place in the free world, this site must respond: services like WhatsApp have already pledged to withdraw from UK if the bill becomes law.

This thread is not a place for flaming, digressions from the topic of this original thread post, 'walls of text', etc. as these have caused the stalling of previously mentioned YCM issues in the past. I have contacted forum moderators and asked them to keep an eye on this thread.

There is possibility, however unlikely, that UK will allow a third option; or that they won't but Parliament/PM office will kick the tories out of majority rule and repeal the law, or at least scale it way down to the point where it is not a threat - but there's no guarantee. Alternatively, there's a chance that neither of those things happen but either YCMaker or the site's provider does not withdraw. I have created this petition to avoid such a worst case scenario, but ultimately, that is their choice, and this is mine: If this bill becomes law, then for as long as it is in enforceable effect and YCM hasn't signaled to us a pullout, I will not be using YCM's forums or its card maker.

(I am also requesting, on the side, that the option for users to manually delete their accounts will be reinstated, like in the forum's early days with the store, just in case worst comes to worst.)

@YCMaker @Falling Pizza @Flame Dragon

EDIT LOG

9/25/2023 - Reworded the request of the petition in consideration of British YCM forum veterans such as British Soul below

10/6/2023 - Clarity edits

11/13/2023 - It appears the bill is now law, posted an article in a reply here. IIRC it says full effects will wait until 2026 but the spy clause is part of the law now. Whether it's enforceable remains to be seen but I still think

Damn