Political Violence

[Dad]

If your line of ratonilizing the presence of a group of people who have threatened (publicly) the safety of innocents, and have (there's plenty of proud boys on camera who have beaten people up if you bother to look) started fights is because they "respect personal space", then this argument is moot.

 

I can respect your personal space and still put a bullet between your eyes. That's a piss poor argument and you know it.

 

"Racist or not" those proud boys won't give a funk about your personal space because you're a black man in America. That's factually true. But as long as you respect them for their views and tolerate their intolerance, maybe they'll kill you last.

[Phantom Roxas]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny-news-university-virginia-richard-spencer-banned-20181026-story.html

 

White supremacist Richard Spencer is banned from University of Virginia for his role in Unite the Right, and his wife is divorcing him after years of domestic abuse, including choking her and breaking her jaw while she was four months pregnant with their daughter.

 

And this is someone who "cares about people"?

[Proto]

 

no, that's not even remotely true. it's more common for attacks to be caught on camera would be a reasonable excuse, but attacks on obama supporters overall, did not happen with anywhere near the frequency. cameras ay not have been as common, but it is a straight up fact. not to say attacks never ever happened, but if you're trying to say attacks were more, or even equally as common, you're wrong. plain and simple. people STILL weat obaba apparel today, and you se nothing even remotely close to the hysteria that a single maga cap inspires. i can name dozens of stories, no camera involved, where people have been kicked out of restaraunts and assaulted in public spaces for wearing MAGA apparel, just by the police stats alone there's more attacks overall in the past 2 years on trump supporters that in all of obama's past 8. that's just the past 2 years, and just the police reported ones.

 

Nothing at all. They did nothing but exist with a different opinion. Which one of them attacked you? None of them. Yet you support violence against them. Do you have so little faith in your view that you think violence is the only way to get your way? Use words, not violence. Do i agree with the views of the proud boys? Not a chance in hell. But i have 100% confidence that i'd trash them intellectually. I don't need to resort to violence. That's how you change minds. Violence only sets people deeper into their trenches. Support debate, not random attacks. You wanna talk about divisive? How about the people who'll attack anybody in the country, so long as some random person screams nazi beforehand. How are you going to change their mind when you won't stop attacking them? You can shut down an event, but all you're doing is showing they have something worth hearing. You don't have to think so, your blatant fear of their words is all that's needed to prove it. Racist or not, the proud boys have harmed 0 innocents, destroyed 0 property, interrupted/ crashed 0 events, and started 0 fights. When it comes down to it, i'd rather have them than antifa. Because they respect personal space.

Saying "people wear Obama attire now" when the shock value and media anger regarding him has died down incredibly hard is an incredibly bad argument. Give the Maga cap 8-10 years and see how many people actually care about it. It's like someone wearing a Reagan/Bush shirt or some sheet. Like their policies were traumatic to a lot of people, but it was a long enough time ago, and media hasn't covered it soon enough that it doesn't feel like a real, active threat. And give me the police stats because you guys are pretty bad at the whole sources thing.

 

They respect personal space because they have the luxury of being able to have a viewpoint that isn't out of line with the ones that this country was founded upon. If you believe that you can "just debate" white nationalists then you have no idea about how the concept of racism works. It's not something logical that someone can just think about and not be racist anymore in most cases, it doesn't make sense, it's like trying to curb someone else from a religion. And even if racism was something comparable to say, an economic policy and these people ran off of statistics and fact instead of presuppositions and anecdote. There is a lot of proof that the debate format doesn't actually "change minds" at all. I don't do this for you or Melkor to stop being conservative, I do this mostly out of entertainment and so kids or young adults looking at this website don't immediately see your view as "normal" or something that's informed in the slightest.

 

When someone gets their entire money stream by being a racist piece of garbage, even if they're convinced to not be a racist piece of garbage I don't think that they can just walk away and admit "hey I lost I'm a liberal now". No! That's straight up shooting themselves in the foot in terms of power, donors and everything. Since these people are by the books capitalistic and since they've developed their whole platform and success off of being racist, they literally have no incentive to change their ways. And in order to maintain that success they'll do whatever it takes to maintain the rage that surrounds them.

 

Whenever you see someone who caters to a mostly conservative audience like Ben Shapiro stating something that is even remotely critical "If your immediate thoughts about the bombs is 'FALSE FLAG' you're delusional" and you look at the comments you see a massive amount of anger and backlash. The same with Jordan Peterson when he mentioned that the most powerful move for the Republican Congress to do as a result of the Kavanaugh controversy would be to just elect another candidate. Their comments got absolutely flooded with comments about how upset their fanbase is. Meanwhile, Candace Owens reaffirming that there was "No way that the bomber was a conservative." even after being proven directly wrong STILL remains to be one of her most popular tweets. People don't care about facts, they care about getting their assumptions justified by popular figures regardless of how many numbers get fudged or how tinted the lenses are.

 

The Proud Boys already have their "foots in the door" ideologically, heavy players in the Republican scene have already showed sympathy to them. https://thinkprogress.org/proud-boys-miami-nancy-pelosi-nelson-diaz-florida-republicans-0fab787e0ddc/ Nelson Dias is the chairman of the the republican party in Miami and he was the one who organized this event. Gavin, who is the leader of the Proud Boys literally created Vice. He is VERY good at marketing and seeming "cool" to hide his white supremacist views. If left to themselves do you really think its farfetched to say that they would be able to influence politicians if gone unchecked given that he already has? Would Nelson Dias even know they were white supremacists if not for the brawl that drew it wide open?

 

EDIT: https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/413467-pittsburgh-synagogue-shooter-yelled-anti-semitic-slur-before

 

 

But hey both sides! Nazis didn't do anything wrong right? Totally nonviolent, that group. funk Antifa right bros?

 

 

Trump was 100% right to mention both sides actually, cuz Antifa is just as bad as the Nazis.

 

Keep debating about Antifa when a white supremacist shot two black grandparents in a church, this week, saw a white guy, said "Whites don't kill whites" and went on with this day.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/25/us/louisville-kroger-shooting.html

 

Keep debating about Antifa when your president's reaction to someone opening fire on a synagogue for entirely anti-semetic reasons with an assault rifle and injuring three fully armed policemen is that "If they had more protection the results would've been better."

 

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2018/10/27/pittsburgh-synagogue-shooting-suspect-identified/

 

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/10/27/us/ap-us-shooting-synagogue-the-latest.html

 

Keep debating about some fucks in masks who haven't killed anyone when you have Trump-loving maniacs literally mailing bombs to political dissenders.

 

And all of the above? Same week.

 

I'm done debating ya'll. Warn me if you want. I've got nothing more to say.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

What? When ANTIFA beat people in Ca there were no Nazis...jesus what a filmy gaslight. Maybe English isn't your first language but let me explain this to you.

 

Both sides are evil. Antifa is just as bad as the Nazis, does not mean that every time one group does something vile, the other side will be there too.

 

Try again

[Proto]

What? When ANTIFA beat people in Ca there were no Nazis...jesus what a filmy gaslight. Maybe English isn't your first language but let me explain this to you.

 

Both sides are evil. Antifa is just as bad as the Nazis, does not mean that every time one group does something vile, the other side will be there too.

 

Try again

Absolutely no nazis in berkeley right?

 

 

TRY AGAIN

[Dad]

One of them wants you dead because you're not white. The other wants you beaten for being a racist piece of sheet.

 

The only good racist is a dead racist so I'll keep long with Antifa.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Absolutely no nazis in berkeley right?

 

 

TRY AGAIN

Did I say Berkeley? 

[Proto]

Did I say Berkeley? 

when you say CA i'm from california. I assume you're talking about my state's shortened term "CA". Maybe use your words a little better next time or cite some funking sources instead of just parroting unsubstanciated regurgitated right wing gibberish and there'd be less confusion? Or are you afraid to actually move the discourse up to a level that isn't just he said she said tier bullshit?

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

One of them wants you dead because you're not white. The other wants you beaten for being a racist piece of sheet.

 

The only good racist is a dead racist so I'll keep long with Antifa.

One wants to kill anyone right of stalin (has openly admitted they want cap the president), but has only so far been able to give people life long brain injuries.

 

That's pretty much my views on the Nazis tbh, the only good anarchist is a dead one, and I'm fine with the Nazis taking them out. 

when you say CA i'm from california. I assume you're talking about my state's shortened term "CA". Maybe use your words a little better next time or cite some funking sources instead of just parroting unsubstanciated regurgitated right wing gibberish and there'd be less confusion? Or are you afraid to actually move the discourse up to a level that isn't just he said she said tier bullshit?

I didn't realize California meant Berkeley, is this a recent change? 

Like c'mon Antifa raids Ben Shapiro speeches, is he one of those rare Jewish Nazis

[Proto]

One wants to kill anyone right of stalin (has openly admitted they want cap the president), but has only so far been able to give people life long brain injuries.

 

That's pretty much my views on the Nazis tbh, the only good anarchist is a dead one, and I'm fine with the Nazis taking them out. 

And one murdered about 20 people altogether if we go by counts. 

 

I hope you realize the position you're holding, they're murdering blacks and jews because of your villification of the anarchic right? You've made your stance clear that you value someone's ability to take out people who have not murdered anyone more then people who are literally massacreing minorities for no reason other then that they are minorities.

 

Also, again Melkor. CITE THE funking INCIDENT SO I CAN PROVE YOU WRONG YOU COWARD. 

[Phantom Roxas]

One wants to kill anyone right of stalin (has openly admitted they want cap the president), but has only so far been able to give people life long brain injuries.

 

That's pretty much my views on the Nazis tbh, the only good anarchist is a dead one, and I'm fine with the Nazis taking them out. 

I didn't realize California meant Berkeley, is this a recent change? 

Like c'mon Antifa raids Ben Shapiro speeches, is he one of those rare Jewish Nazis

 

I think Proto means that when you say there were no Nazis when referring to an incident in California, then showing that Nazis were in Berkeley, California does indeed prove that there are Nazis in California. The issue would be that if Proto proving that there were Nazis in California refers to the same event that you were describing, because I'm not sure if you guys are talking about the same thing, or talking about different situations.

 

It's basically an "all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares" scenario. Berkeley is always going to mean California, but California is not always going to be about Berkeley specifically.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

And one murdered about 20 people altogether if we go by counts. 

 

I hope you realize the position you're holding, they're murdering blacks and jews because of your villification of the anarchic right? You've made your stance clear that you value someone's ability to take out people who have not murdered anyone more then people who are literally massacreing minorities for no reason other then that they are minorities.

 

Also, again Melkor. CITE THE funking INCIDENT SO I CAN PROVE YOU WRONG YOU COWARD. 

Antifa has openly said they wanna kill people, it's not my fault they're lucky a funk to not pass that threshold. 

 

https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/.premium-ben-shapiro-to-antifa-protesters-at-berkeley-go-to-hell-1.5451158

 

How about this?

 

Or the firebombing of Milo's speech. Even if you consider Milo a nazi, firebombing his speeches nationwide? Just speeches may I add

 

https://www.westernjournal.com/antifa-shut-intersection-threaten/

 

Or how about this, they shut down an intersection because the cops show a man, and threaten violence against ordinary citizen (who are mostly likely liberal because of the city this is in). They're filth on the same caliber as the nazis 

 

My view is the same as Dads...so no, I don't really care

I think Proto means that when you say there were no Nazis when referring to an incident in California, then showing that Nazis were in Berkeley, California does indeed prove that there are Nazis in California. The issue would be that if Proto proving that there were Nazis in California refers to the same event that you were describing, because I'm not sure if you guys are talking about the same thing, or talking about different situations.

 

It's basically an "all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares" scenario. Berkeley is always going to mean California, but California is not always going to be about Berkeley specifically.

Ben has his speech in UCLA, I think raided, too

 

It's not a Berkley only problem

 

It's not a CA only problem either, but CA might be the the one place where Antifa is supported

[Proto]

Antifa has openly said they wanna kill people, it's not my fault they're lucky a funk to not pass that threshold. 

 

https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/.premium-ben-shapiro-to-antifa-protesters-at-berkeley-go-to-hell-1.5451158

 

How about this?

 

Or the firebombing of Milo's speech. Even if you consider Milo a nazi, firebombing his speeches nationwide? Just speeches may I add

 

My view is the same as Dads...so no, I don't really care

Oh, guess where it is?

 

Berkeley.

 

funk off. 

 

Dad's ideology is entirely different because he is working off of a basis of something that has previously happened in America before which is black and jews were killed due to conspiracies regarding their evils as a race. History repeats itself and the K.K.K. and modern day of neo-nazis each have their ties what with David Duke being a major link between both of them. YOURS is entirely unsubstantiated because not only has no anarchist killed anyone, but major anarchists have never been a major player in the United States' history as thus you are going off of the fear of a threat rather then knowing that yes, this is a possibility because it has happened before. 

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

tl;dr

 

Dads's philosophy is ok cuz he advocates killing the right people lol

[Proto]

tl;dr

 

Dads's philosophy is ok cuz he advocates killing the right people lol

Nice misrepresentation.

 

I'll use metaphor. Dad has seen a earthquake before and thinks people are going to start another earthquake so he suggests killing them. You're anticipating a funking laser to nuke America and want to kill those people who "might" do it when nothing of the sort has ever happened nor does the trend suggest that anything near the amount of power could ever let it happen.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Right, because left wing violence has never happened. Unlike clearly dad, and you, I've read history, and the red were vital in Hitler's rise. You're gonna keep moving the goalposts, so let me get to PA

 

---

 

 

 

 

What a fan of Trump this guy was

[Proto]

Right, because left wing violence has never happened. Unlike clearly dad, and you, I've read history, and the red were vital in Hitler's rise. You're gonna keep moving the goalposts, so let me get to PA

 

---

 

 

What a fan of Trump this guy was

Why are you comparing a country with a booming funking economy and the strongest military in the world with post World War 1 Germany? What the hell are with these comparisons from you?

 

"Stop moving goalposts" *MOVES GOALPOSTS TO AN ENTIRE DIFFERENT funking COUNTRY*

 

When did I ever mention him being a fan of Trump? Quote me.

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

Yall are getting far too heated. Will unlock after work and figure out if WPs are needed. Take this time to cool off please.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

https://t.co/UBEZFx3gFm?amp=1

[Dad]

That poor man was threatened with a bb gun for doing his job.

 

Meanwhile a dozen or so people are dead because some anti-semitic piece of sheet decided that "all jews must die".

 

I'm curious who came from where.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

That poor man was threatened with a bb gun for doing his job.

 

Meanwhile a dozen or so people are dead because some anti-semitic piece of sheet decided that "all jews must die".

 

I'm curious who came from where.

Given the post who shot the jews thinks Trump is a "Jew loving globalist pedophile"

 

He certainly didn't come from my side

[Dad]

Given the post who shot the jews thinks Trump is a "Jew loving globalist pedophile"

 

He certainly didn't come from my side

 

People usually travel out of state when they do these types of things.  I wasn't alluding to parties.  But sure, let's go with that.

[Proto]

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/article220574455.html

 

“He said something about being a Republican, I said I am a Republican, he said ‘Motherf***** you ain’t s***,’” Partee said.

@

 

So, Republicans threatening a fellow black Republican for no reason other then he is black. And said the n-word. Real good example for your side there Melky. Really shows the "both sides" of the situation.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

 

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/article220574455.html

 

“He said something about being a Republican, I said I am a Republican, he said ‘Motherf***** you ain’t s***,’” Partee said.

@

 

So, Republicans threatening a fellow black Republican for no reason other then he is black. And said the n-word. Real good example for your side there Melky. Really shows the "both sides" of the situation.

 

He wasn't registered to vote lol. He's about as republican as the clown in PA

 

Maybe he was one of those republicans that cared so much for the election that they're gonna lose their right to vote, and not be registered before that too?

[Proto]

Man says he's Republican, and he wasn't registered to vote because he's a felon.

 

Committing a crime doesn't make you not have political beliefs.