(TCG) May 21st Banlist

[~British Soul~]

http://www.yugioh-card.com/uk/gameplay/detail.php?id=1155

 

Banned:

Master Peace

Astrograph Sorceror

Phoenixian Cluster Amaryllis

Supreme King Dragon Starving Venom

Ancient Fairy Dragon

RUM Argent Chaos Force

That Grass

 

Limited:

Dinomight Knight

Gem-Knight Master Diamond

Chain Strike

 

Semi:

Apoqliphort Towers

Ring of Destruction

 

Unlimited:

Atlantean Dragoons

Ignis Heat

Grandsoil

Mathmetician

Grand Mole

Compulsory Evacuation Device  

[Hallohallo]

>Astrograph

>SKSD Starving Venom

>Forbidden

 

Hf playing this game guys. I'm out.

[Dokutah]

What the funk. RUM argent forbidden?!

May we meet again my beloved Master Peace. At least i get Killer at my side? Well other main decks is return atleast

I kinda not sure about SKSDSV on same basis argument as Neptune but this being easier to make is understandable

Dang they partially kill Stromberg Engine before it comes

So long 60 card deck power house, thanks for the good memories

The rest not really much. Probs Grandmole needed for the new Neos support for CYHO

[VCR_CAT]

This banlist takes effect May 21st, so please have the title reflect that.

 

What the heck is even going on here. I assume the RUM is some sort of FTK/OTK? Master Diamond as that surprise background tech (seriously this is news to me, what are you DOING there?!)

 

And as for the rest: Astrograph is disappointing, yet expected. Starving Venom was written all over the wall (Independent wasn't even the only nonsense you could do with that card; it had it coming) and everything else is just kind of, okay...

 

Honestly, the disappointment here is that this banlist is only going to serve to further bring the game down. The hits compared to the unhits shows that, overall, nothing was actually really brought up to snuff at all and it was just kind of crowd-pleasing spring cleaning that won't mean anything.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

The banlist we desperately needed. Burn in hell Astrograph and good riddance Master Peace.

 

Amaryllis was also the right hit, props are in order there. I was just talking about how Utopic ZEXAL should be banned too but hitting Chaos Force gets that done just as well. 

 

What the heck is even going on here. I assume the RUM is some sort of FTK/OTK? Master Diamond as that surprise background tech (seriously this is news to me, what are you DOING there?!)

 

ZEXAL lock and Gem-Knight FTK.

[Black D'Sceptyr]

>Astrograph

>SKSD Starving Venom

>Forbidden

 

Hf playing this game guys. I'm out.

 

I mean, Astrograph was the right hit, especially considering the degeneracy it enabled. You've still got Electrumitte for your Pendulum Plays. I'd gone for Nightingale over Starving Venom but...

 

[mido9]

That banned/limited list looks like it's 75% obscure OTKs/FTKs

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

Amaryllis, Master Diamond and SDSK were integral pieces of some of the most relevant FTKs ever. Very glad they were hit, but still need to hit (Toon) Cannon Soldier and Amazon Archer because they're searchable Mass Drivers. ABC FTK is just around the corner.  

[Blake]

Astrograph is a reasonably fair card, anyone saying it should be hit doesn't know this game at all.

 

The card only does stuff if your deck enables it and/or through Electrumite, and even the Electrumite example isn't always true, because there are a ton of times you'd rather do other things with it. Astro was an enabler that Pendulums needed to function given its versatility, but it was not the problem in any way, shape, or form.

 

List is generally good, but that ban was awful.

 

Also, True Draco with Dino/Ignis >>>>>>>>> True Draco with Master Peace.

[Ultimagamer]

I like that they are finally taking the long overdue semi-limits and either hitting them harder or just unbanning them. How long did dragoons really need a semi-limit for?

 

Grandmole has been limited for a long time, it's nice to have him back at 3. 

 

Will Grandsoil see play in elementalsabers? It's a monster reborn, might not be bad 

[Thomas★Zero]

That banned/limited list looks like it's 75% obscure OTKs/FTKs

That's the likely case though Konami hadn't banned Lyrilusc - Independent Nightingale for all the shenanigans that it can pull off.

 

Still with this list find it nice that both Grand Mole and Compulsory Evacuation device are back to 3 plus a friend of mine will enjoy having 3 Atlantean Dragoons also...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...Master Peace, more like Master Trash now that its been banned...

 

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

I actually can't stop laughing at the fact chain strike is at 1.

 

Oh funk dinomight is back. funk yes.

 

WAIT NO AFD NOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

Astrograph is a reasonably fair card, anyone saying it should be hit doesn't know this game at all.

 

If this were the case then Yu-Gi-Oh! would be an extremely obscure game indeed. 

[SANDAA BORUTO]

http://www.yugioh-card.com/uk/gameplay/detail.php?id=1155

 

Banned:

Master Peace Bye.

Astrograph Sorceror RIP Zarc. It's sad, but this buddy had to go.

Phoenixian Cluster Amaryllis Dumb FTK is dumb, Konami doesn't like that.

Supreme King Dragon Starving Venom Wait what?

Ancient Fairy Dragon RIP. Press F to pay respects. (In all seriousness, she was getting too strong)

RUM Argent Chaos Force Wait, WHAT?!

That Grass f*** off, you cancerous piece of s***.

 

Limited:

Dinomight Knight So, Dracos trade Master Peace for this. Sounds fair.

Gem-Knight Master Diamond Had to be done, as much as I don't like to admit it.

Chain Strike Uhhhh... Okay?

 

Semi:

Apoqliphort Towers No where near as powerful as in the Arc V era. It's strong, yes, but we have Kaijus to deal with it now.

Ring of Destruction A bit dangerous. Even with the errata, Ring is still a very good card.

 

Unlimited:

Atlantean Dragoons This was on the list?

Ignis Heat Okay.

Grandsoil Why was this banned, actually? I don't remember.

Mathmetician He got powercrept. It's good to have him back at 3 though.

Grand Mole FINALLY!!! YES!!!!

Compulsory Evacuation Device  3 Compulse, 3 Bottomless AND 3 Torrential? That's crazy!

 

I rate this one Stratos is Still Banned/10.

[Dragulas]

Banned:

 

Master Peace: About time, a meta deck based around this kind of strategy shouldnt be alive that long 

 

Astrograph Sorceror: Personally I think a Limit would ve been enugh, but its understandable

 

Phoenixian Cluster Amaryllis: FTK i guess, nothing to add

 

Supreme King Dragon Starving Venom: This is a mistake, Nightingale is the one who should 've been here, if anything a limit could be placed to test first (if gale was banned of course)

 

Ancient Fairy Dragon: FTKs and other shenanigans she was asking for it.

 

RUM Argent Chaos Force: I m lost here

 

That Grass: Finally those 60 garbage decks are out of this game, this card was the epidemy of poor deckbuilding to me

 

 

 

Limited:

 

Dinomight Knight: MP is gone so its fine

 

Gem-Knight Master Diamond: Lapiz Lazuli: should be banned, this doesnt belong here

 

Chain Strike: Burn can burn in hell, I like this hit

 

 

 

Semi:

 

Apoqliphort Towers: Irrelevant

 

Ring of Destruction: Lair of darkness and the new useless dragon, makes sense

 

 

 

Unlimited:

 

Atlantean Dragoons: Lack of hard OPT dont let me agree with this, 2 was the perfect number

 

Ignis Heat: Makes sense but i would ve left it semi at least

 

Grandsoil: Errata

 

Mathmetician: About time

 

Grand Mole: About damn time

 

Compulsory Evacuation Device: About f***ing damn time

 

The List isn't bad, but I don't think is good (on many hits) either, the best decks were addressed that's something I give them to, however, Things like FTKs were addressed in the wrong direction. Also wonder when we would get construct back

Cards that should ve been in this list regardless: 

 

Similimited

Dragonic Diagram: The lack of hard OPT matters more than we think, it shouldn't be at 3, but doesn't need to be at 1 or banned 

Card of demise: TD still have diagram, this and desires it still too consistent

 

Limited

Fairy tail Snow: Grass gone shouldn't justify this being at 3

Lonfire blossom: Its run at 3 just for deckthining you only need one, this actually might hint that we won't get the aroma link any time soon

Terraforming: I still don't know why TCG Konami refuses to limit this

Trickstar reincarnation: Stops the droll lock and forces them to play the way they should in the first place

[Thomas★Zero]

@SANDAA BORUTO you say Z-Arcs dead without Astrograph but we still have Chronograph for summoning Z-Arc with Odd-Eyes and the Fusion, Synchro and Xyz Pendulum Magicians.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

Grandsoil Why was this banned, actually? I don't remember.

 

He could be looped with Enterblathnir to banish your opponent's entire deck turn 1 among other absurd loop shenanigans but is being errata'd to be a hard once per turn which is why he can be at 3 now. 

[Black D'Sceptyr]

Astrograph is a reasonably fair card, anyone saying it should be hit doesn't know this game at all.

 

The card only does stuff if your deck enables it and/or through Electrumite, and even the Electrumite example isn't always true, because there are a ton of times you'd rather do other things with it. Astro was an enabler that Pendulums needed to function given its versatility, but it was not the problem in any way, shape, or form.

 

List is generally good, but that ban was awful.

 

Devil's advocate here: The Astrograph hit wasn't hard ENOUGH, especially considering Zefras are fit to waltz into the Tier 1 space Zarcgicians once occupied. 

 

I'd argue SPYRAL Quik Fix should have already shown that non-OPT effects on self-summon/replacement cards are begging for abuse. And knowing how the game is like doesn't mean I want it to be MORE LIKE THAT-slower and steadier, please and thank you. 

 

Besides, "function" and "un-interestingly turning into Galaxy Tomahawk/Odd-Eyes Absolute for Link-laddering/stun shenanigans" limits Pendulums design more than expands them. They're as good as you say they are, they shouldn't need Astrograph to do what they do-and if they're that reliant on a Level 7 one-trick Pendulum they were fragile anyways. Dumbspam is something I'd prefer Pendulums move away from, especially given their inherent durability due to their retreat to the Extra Deck upon leaving the field.

 

Now, I forgot to talk about the other cards on the list in my original post, so here goes. 

 

Supreme King Starving Venom:  I'm in agreement with VCR_CAT: That hit was 10% about it abusing Independent Nightingale and 90% about it abusing Heavymetalfoes Electrumite. Good f'n riddance.

 

Gem-Knight Master Diamond: not the hit on Gem-Knights I wanted (damn that Brilliant) but I accept it because of Lapis Lazuli.

 

Amaryllis: see above, but for Plants (also, really, I'd have preferred a strike at Lonefire like the last time it was involved in a stupid broken Plant Deck). Fine as is tho. 

 

Mathmatician and Dragoons: Eating up the Normal Summon like groceries is the main reason I'm fine with Mathe back at 3. Dragoons at 3 tho....oh boy, keep an eye on Merlanteans, fellas. 

 

Ancient Fairy Dragon: eee....fifth hit and second ban I wish went to a different card-in this case, Terraforming (as well as a return of Set Rotation (to unlimited status) and/or Chicken Game (to limited status). But yeah, what injured the meta crippled the non-meta (especially F.A.s, goodness gracious) It cannot be helped, though. Whoda though that the first Signer Dragon to be hit would be LUNA's though, especially considering Black Rose's Limited hit so long ago. 

 

Towers and Ring: Again, not the Qli card I wanted to bring off Limited status: Saqlifice would have been better. Ring....okay. 

 

That Grass: Because messing with the Deck en masse is now as busted as messing with the Grave en masse was pre-Links (hence, Emeral's banning). At least Infernoids have Lair and Lightsworns have...everyone mistaking it for Infernities, Konami's red-headed stepchild of Decks.  (seriously wtaf is with them knocking out stuff for peripherally offering aid and comfort to INFERNITIES?!?!)

 

Ignis Heat & Dinomight Knight: With Peace gone, these are less potent threats, so have at them, TCG. Though I still think Monarchs Erupt should have been hit- because, BD'S Rule number 1.2 says Summon locks just CANNOT BE DONE PROPERLY, especially on TRAPS.

 

Compulsory & Chain Strike: CED probably may be the more potent form of removal now that Links are a thing and destruction profiteering is something present everywhere. The latter hit might be a preliminary one to keep Chain Burn from sweeping Worlds again. 

 

Grand Mole & Grandsoil; former would have been powercreeped ten banlists ago, and moreso now. Latter got errated, so its fine (somewhat, the EARTH Archetype is still a bit rife for abuse with this card; Lithosagym suffered that as well). 

 

Argent Chaos Force: I KNEW IT AND CALLED IT! This was because of the 3B: Blame Beatrice & Bochum. Zarcgicians abused it there and now it got hit for it.

 

[~British Soul~]

I rate this one Stratos is Still Banned/10.

10/10 Best meme every list    .

[Darj]

Mostly pleased eith the banlist, expect for a couple of cards, because of personal preferences:

 

Master Peace is gone. Makes me sad since I was a fan of it, but I understand why it was hit. I really wanted to see the day where Diagram+Peace would have been played as a semi-splashable engine for backrow-ish decks who can use dead floodgates as Tribute fodder, but as it was proven, it was strong enough to become its own deck with the assistance of draw power cards.

At least more of the lesser True Dracos are available to keep Diagram alive.

Astrograph deserved the hit, IMO. I was expecting a Limit a most, but they actually took it to 0. No complaints, though.

Fairy Dragon had it coming.

Starving Venom finally banned. Can we get Neptune back now? :v

 

I'm surprised TCG cared enough to hit the OTK/FTKs with Amaryllis, Master Diamond, and even Chain Strike. Heck, I didn't even know Argent Chaos Force was doing anything problematic.

 

A bit confused about the ban on Greener. Was it still relevant? IIRC is not doing much in OCG, if anything at all. IDK its position in TCG, though.

 

Was a bit concerned about Grandsoil going to 3, but thanks for reminding me that it's getting a hard OPT errata.

 

When will they allow for more copies of Scout. It's about time since OCG has it at 3 and yet Qliphorts are nowhere to be seen among the top tiers.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

60 card decks were a solid tier 2 the past format and the tier 1 decks were hit, don't think the Grass hit was necessary either though especially with the advent of Knightmare Gouki/SPYRAL, Altergeists, Brandish, etc. 

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

CED probably may be the more potent form of removal now that Links are a thing and destruction profiteering is something present everywhere.

What link monster would be better to remove with compulse than with more accessible removal?

[Blake]

Devil's advocate here: The Astrograph hit wasn't hard ENOUGH, especially considering Zefras are fit to waltz into the Tier 1 space Zarcgicians once occupied. 

 

I'd argue SPYRAL Quik Fix should have already shown that non-OPT effects on self-summon/replacement cards are begging for abuse. And knowing how the game is like doesn't mean I want it to be MORE LIKE THAT-slower and steadier, please and thank you. 

 

Besides, "function" and "un-interestingly turning into Galaxy Tomahawk/Odd-Eyes Absolute for Link-laddering/stun shenanigans" limits Pendulums design more than expands them. They're as good as you say they are, they shouldn't need Astrograph to do what they do-and if they're that reliant on a Level 7 one-trick Pendulum they were fragile anyways. Dumbspam is something I'd prefer Pendulums move away from, especially given their inherent durability due to their retreat to the Extra Deck upon leaving the field.

Let's get something out of the way at the start.

 

Pendulum is an inherently weak mechanic.

 

It requires far more startup than any other mechanic, is fairly easy to disrupt at almost any stage of said setup, and it doesn't have nearly the bounce back potential that people act like it does. Their "durability" isn't even a good argument, because that's generally used as an offensive option in setting up T1 or breaking boards later, as opposed to being a comeback mechanic. It requires a tone of input to get average or somewhat above average payouts.

 

The game will never be truly slow and steady. TCG is "slow and steady" right now. Your expectations are completely unrealistic, and they reflect neither the direction of the game nor the feelings of the players at large.

 

Astrograph was bad before Links, with even its best deck, Metalfoe, having it be barely more than a tech. It was bad with Links, due to the fact that it still had to be drawn and procced by outside cards.

 

Electrumite made it good. It made it so that you could afford playing it, afford playing Stargazer, and have a little bit more value to make your plays with. It even did so for Chronograph, who is generally worse than Astrograph, in theory.

 

Astrograph is only unfair when it can be grabbed from the deck _and_ the ED by Electrumite. 3-1 ratio engines for SSing a Pendulum, such as 3 Astro 1 Stargazer, are perfectly fair. Being able to SS it and renew advantage with how costly a mechanic Pendulum turned out to be... is fair. What Astrograph does is incredibly fair.

 

I'm not saying that Electrumite needs a ban, either, though that card is ridiculously strong... But Astrograph is a goodstuff card. There is absolutely nothing wrong with goodstuff existing in the game. He doesn't do too much on his own, even in decks that love popping their own cards. He just makes it so that you're more likely to have enough resources to function.

 

Because, let's face it- Pendulums aren't good, right now. Many of them are decent cards, but their prevalence in TCG is due to a slowed gamestate (which is, in turn, due to bad sets being released) + Electrumite, but the decks themselves don't function without advantage generation like Astrograph. Why do you think Darkwurm is such a good card, despite searching cards that are pretty so-so in their own rights?

 

It's also not a 1-trick pony. You (and many others) choose to use tunnel vision to only see 'optimal' plays, ignoring how often Electrumite didn't even go into Astrograph, in favor of stronger setup and combos. Astro is consistency and support, it's not some core degeneracy that breaks everything.

 

Your post is so full of "haha funk the meta AMIRITE" that it's plain unpleasant.

 

You're also... completely wrong about Starving Venom. It has nothing to do with copying Electrum, considering you can always run more Electrum (not to say copying electrum with it is bad), it has to do with the fact that Nightingale exists and self-copying is ridiculously strong, especially considering cards in the future like Odd-Eyes Revolution Dragon. That type of effect is funking ridiculous, and SKDSV was one of the strongest options that pendulum decks had, completely overshadowing cards like SKDDR.

[Black D'Sceptyr]

What link monster would be better to remove with compulse than with more accessible removal?

 

I more meant that it would be more useful in comparison to the other banlist-freed Traps we've gotten recently, like Bottomless, Torrential, and Ring of Destruction. 

 

Should have clarified that, yes. 

 

But in terms of removal, most of that is negation/destruction for the higher-builds, or removal so fast that this will be sniped unless you're going first. (True Dracos can still accomplish that, as can Altergeists.)

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Why isn't knuckle back if MP is gone?