Enguin's Ban

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Because even if that is a joke people damn well believe the Holocaust wasn't real. You don't get to pretend to be an anti-semite. That isn't ok..

This also confused me. NeoNazis exist, so we can't make holocaust jokes. Jihadists exist, so I can't make 9/11 jokes? Are you willing to ban every single person on this site who has made a "steel beams" joke?

 

Cowcow's point is also valid. But where I'll differ from him is that I actually do care about this ban, not cause I'm splitting my sides over "work will set you free," but rather cause extra-judicial bans are become more and more common place. Today it was Enguin for being enguin, tomorrow it'll be Raeg or me or someone else who had a problem with an other Islamic attack. 

 

Shard deliberately called for action against the jews, and that's a step too far, unless something similar is done, this is extra judicial and there shouldn't even be warning pts let alone a ban

 

If you guys cannot had a fix standard by which you can dispense punishment without emotion. Ya'll need to step down

 

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Different question, who edited Enguin's thread and got rid of the title criticizing Sakura? Remeber when Striker did something similar to Hina?

[Flame Dragon]

Can you explain to me how Enguin's comments were worse than shard's? 

 

Can you show me how Enguin repeatedly called for death to the jews or anything similar. Ok, and Snatch I think said 6M was a mistake? Yeh we should, guess who else agrees with me

 

 

I don't make Holocaust jokes cause it rings a little too close to home for comfort. But that doesn't mean I get a right to ban or silence someone for something I personally don't like

They don't need to be worse. You can say things not as bas as Shard and still be saying things that are crossing a line that should not be crossed. My point is, we need to have zero tolerance towards these types of comments. We need to SHOW that we have zero tolerance for this type of thing. The only failing in this case is that Enguin could have been giving a warning to knock it off, but seeing as how I've been told he has gotten that message before that doesn't really hold here.

 

"Any time it has been allowed to fly on the forum is a failure on the mod teams part."

 

My job as a moderator is to allow anyone and everyone to be comfortable in using the forum. If someone to able to post things making light of the Holocaust without repercussion that isn't going to happen. If someone says "A second Holocaust? When was the first?" they should be punished for it. The question then become the type. If it is someone who has made a habit of doing it, that means a ban with the possibility of it being a permanent one. If you want to argue that it shouldn't be permanent, as said fine, I can believe that it shouldn't have been. But, again, this was going to be a ban. The question was how long.

 

And if you're going to continue ignoring what you told me you'd follow through with (the scaling system) then how do you expect my trust?

This is why I'm willing to believe this shouldn't have been a permeant ban.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Can you explain why Zai seemed pretty tolerant of it back when

 

(1) Discord was still part of YCM justification

(2) He was a mod?

 

Standards for thou, not for me? Yeah I think Holocaust jokes are awful, though disclaimer, I do think I said something on Enguin's status. IDR what, you likely have the screens. But where did this new standard come from

 

I'm asking for this proof of Enguin's repeated explicit antisemitism. Cause dad's case using "Merry Christmas to everyone except jews" is just laughably frail

 

Enguin's holocaust joke was on the more tame side compared to stuff others have said and mods have yucked at

[Tourmaline]

They don't need to be worse. You can say things not as bas as Shard and still be saying things that are crossing a line that should not be crossed. My point is, we need to have zero tolerance towards these types of comments. We need to SHOW that we have zero tolerance for this type of thing. The only failing in this case is that Enguin could have been giving a warning to knock it off, but seeing as how I've been told he has gotten that message before that doesn't really hold here.

 

"Any time it has been allowed to fly on the forum is a failure on the mod teams part."

 

My job as a moderator is to allow anyone and everyone to be comfortable in using the forum. If someone to able to post things making light of the Holocaust without repercussion that isn't going to happen. If someone says "A second Holocaust? When was the first?" they should be punished for it.

 

Also with making light of past racially discriminatory events with humorous intent is a moderator using the word without consequence.

 

Your job as a moderator is not first to make the place comfortable. Just attests to the intellectual cuckery plaguing the place. Your job as a moderator is first to competently grant the rules real-world power with objectivity and impartiality. Comfort afterwards is a mere luxury, especially considering all this cognitive dissonance.

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

The last thing I'll say tonight cause dang it I'm tired why did this have to be so late

 

No one should ever be permanent banned for something that the rules does not cover as permanently bannable.

 

I'm glad to see you say that last bit, Flame, just want to put that out there.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

More to Hina's pt, are you willing to ban everyone who has ever made a "Jet fuel can't melt steal beams" joke?

 

Debates bled out cause of this very form of "intellectual cuckery" as Hina eloquently put it. And yes I have screens of former Debate regulars who felt that after my ban it got white washed to be more "tolerant"

 

This kinda thing is actively killing the site

 

The last thing I'll say tonight cause dang it I'm tired why did this have to be so late

 

No one should ever be permanent banned for something that the rules does not cover as permanently bannable.

 

I'm glad to see you say that last bit, Flame, just want to put that out there.

I second this, I'm irritated with how this was dealt, but I appreciate you've been consistent on this Flame. Have some work to finish, and will like go to bed after that (in case I don't respond)

[Flame Dragon]

This also confused me. NeoNazis exist, so we can't make holocaust jokes. Jihadists exist, so I can't make 9/11 jokes? Are you willing to ban every single person on this site who has made a "steel beams" joke?

 

Cowcow's point is also valid. But where I'll differ from him is that I actually do care about this ban, not cause I'm splitting my sides over "work will set you free," but rather cause extra-judicial bans are become more and more common place. Today it was Enguin for being enguin, tomorrow it'll be Raeg or me or someone else who had a problem with an other Islamic attack. 

 

 

Different question, who edited Enguin's thread and got rid of the title criticizing Sakura? Remeber when Striker did something similar to Hina?

9/11 is a tragedy of a high order, but it is different from the Holocaust. That being said, if someone started saying 9/11 was an inside job I'd tell them to stop and I would warn/ban them if they persisted. As for the steel beams that is a joke at the expense of the people claiming that. And while I can understand someone not liking it, it is different from "A second Holocaust? When was the first?".

 

I already addressed CowCow's point and I have raised the point to the team that we are quick to act. This is different from Broken's promotion since you do want to act quickly after someone breaks a rule, but knowing how to take a step back is something we do lack.

 

Can you explain why Zai seemed pretty tolerant of it back when

 

(1) Discord was still part of YCM justification

(2) He was a mod?

 

Standards for thou, not for me?

I have no idea why. He shouldn't have been. Not sure what I can say past that.

 

 

Also with making light of past racially discriminatory events with humorous intent is a moderator using the word without consequence.

 

Your job as a moderator is not first to make the place comfortable. Just attests to the intellectual cuckery plaguing the place. Your job as a moderator is first to competently grant the rules real-world power with objectivity and impartiality. Comfort afterwards is a mere luxury, especially considering all this cognitive dissonance.

I do not like the n-word. However as a white guy I have zero right to tell a black man how to use it and really don't believe I have any right to partake in that conversation.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

9/11 is a tragedy of a high order, but it is different from the Holocaust. That being said, if someone started saying 9/11 was an inside job I'd tell them to stop and I would warn/ban them if they persisted. As for the steel beams that is a joke at the expense of the people claiming that. And while I can understand someone not liking it, it is different from "A second Holocaust? When was the first?".

 

I already addressed CowCow's point and I have raised the point to the team that we are quick to act. This is different from Broken's promotion since you do want to act quickly after someone breaks a rule, but knowing how to take a step back is something we do lack.

 

 

I have no idea why. He shouldn't have been. Not sure what I can say past that.

Unless you're willing to accuse me of doctoring the image. I have a Jewish mod, who by Dad's attest (he said all mods - Smear & Night), was involved with Enguin being banned for a Holocaust joke. This same mod is on YCM territory saying he's ok and lives for holocaust jokes. 

 

Does that hypocrisy seem fair or right or consistent?

 

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Ok? The status was up for a good while, and the ban sure came fast. So you guys didn't fix the actual offense (I disagree that it was), but act quickly on the ban?

 

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So it's number based? You have to hit x number of dead people before it becomes something you can't say? I'd take a wager you'd be quite upset if I made a the pulse shooting and it would be a faster route to a ban than 9/11 despite diff magnitudes

 

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Again, a mod was editing Enguin's post, and has show hostility towards him. This same mod was involved in his ban (on already merit less grounds). You now stand guilty of (1) ex post facto laws (2) conflicts of interest. Shall I go on?

[Flame Dragon]

Unless you're willing to accuse me of doctoring the image. I have a Jewish mod, who by Dad's attest (he said all mods - Smear & Night), was involved with Enguin being banned for a Holocaust joke. This same mod is on YCM territory saying he's ok and lives for holocaust jokes. 

 

Does that hypocrisy seem fair or right or consistent?

 

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Ok? The status was up for a good while, and the ban sure came fast. So you guys didn't fix the actual offense (I disagree that it was), but act quickly on the ban?

 

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So it's number based? You have to hit x number of dead people before it becomes something you can't say? I'd take a wager you'd be quite upset if I made a the pulse shooting and it would be a faster route to a ban than 9/11 despite diff magnitudes

 

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Again, a mod was editing Enguin's post, and has show hostility towards him. This same mod was involved in his ban (on already merit less grounds). You now stand guilty of (1) post exfacto laws (2)  conflict of interest shall I go on?

Zai's involvement in this is he posted the status in the mod forum saying it wasn't ok. He wasn't sure what to do past that. Not my place to tell him one thing should offend him and another shouldn't. Nor can I guess at why that would be the case.

 

The belief was that telling Enguin to stop would be met with deaf ear and that instead of continuing this the dance to just let it stop. The ban was our way of dealing with the offense.

 

It isn't a number issue. The Holocaust is a state sanctioned ethic cleansing. At its core it is different from most tragedies. That being said my response could have been better worded. A tragedy is a tragedy. To your point about steel beams I honestly don't know how I feel about it, but I do believe it is different in nature from other such things.

 

I have no idea what happened with the thread edit. To argue one mod having a conflict of interest would invalidate the ban is problematic since everyone who gave input said a ban should happen with only one slightly questioning it being permanent.

[The Warden]

Winter, allow me to speak to you in the language of your people, if I may. The case between Shard and Enguin might possess incidental similarities, but that's all they are, incidental similarities. Shard, from what I understand, was deliberately trying to get himself banned, and he achieved that mission. Enguin might just have been the same really, but here's the thing: Enguin just got off a ban.

 

Temporary bans are all about a time-out to get you to reflect on your actions, and maybe make a change to be a better member. The second Enguin got back he proved that he hadn't changed one bit. But we didn't hold it against him; what we did hold against him however was that he just got off a ban, and we'd be scrutinizing him just like one would with someone who had a sentence commuted for parole. Enguin was being watched to observe his actions, and today was merely the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

You might not be aware of this given your own ban that you only recently got off Winter, but Enguin has presented a host of toxic actions around the site that has resulted in many, many warns before. And yet he kept doing what he did, merely tip-toeing the line of bannable offences while wearing his warning points with pride. He is no angel by any stretch of the imagination, but he had been granted far more leniency than he had ever deserved. Today, Enguin crossed the line, and he violated the last scrap of good grace the mod team had for him. Believe you me there is no love lost between the mods and Enguin, that much is certain, but it doesn't change that what he did was very much not okay.

 

He is someone who has wasted chance upon chance upon chance upon chance, and given this was, as I said, post-ban, he successfully wasted his last chance. He knew what he was doing was wrong, but he did it anyways, simply because he could. If it was something in the rules, which is doesn't need too because what he was doing violated common sense, he'd have ignored it anyways and still done it. Enguin doesn't want to change. He doesn't want to be anything else beyond what he is. And now, he can be himself far away from YCM, where he can't bother/offend/insult anyone anymore.

 

I'm sorry if it offends you that you weren't notified well in-advance (in triplicate) so you can okay every our decision, but the fact is is that this wasn't your decision to make. Enguin was a problem. It is the job of the mods to deal with problems. You might not like it, but Enguin crossed a line today. A line written in the sand many decades ago. He violated his parole Winter, and as a firm believer of the judicial system, I'm sure you must understand our actions when it comes to a parole violation.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Zai's involvement in this is he posted the status in the mod forum saying it wasn't ok. He wasn't sure what to do past that. Not my place to tell him one thing should offend him and another shouldn't. Nor can I guess at why that would be the case.

 

The belief was that telling Enguin to stop would be met with deaf ear and that instead of continuing this the dance to just let it stop. The ban was our way of dealing with the offense.

 

It isn't a number issue. The Holocaust is a state sanctioned ethic cleansing. At its core it is different from most tragedies. That being said my response could have been better worded. A tragedy is a tragedy. To your point about steel beams I honestly don't know how I feel about it, but I do believe it is different in nature from other such things.

 

I have no idea what happened with the thread edit. To argue one mod having a conflict of interest would invalidate the ban is problematic since everyone who gave input said a ban should happen with only one slightly questioning it being permanent.

Well now some holocaust jokes are ok, and others aren't. The point to be made here is that a user should not be punished or banned for an activity that a mod gleefully took part in

 

Yeh see that's the same bullshit answer Evil gave too. I don't wanna deal with winter anymore, so I'm just gonna ignore the rest of he ban schedule and just go for the perma (I needed 6 months off for personal reasons, but Koko's question of "why now" was never answered then either)

 

9/11 documents show that Saudi higher ups knew and facilitated the attack. There have been thousands of state sanctions genocides. Hell we've been involved in couple recent.

 

Enguin was banned by Sakura, and he had a thread critical of him. The thread was then edited to remove the references critical of sakura. 

 

That's also not shocking. The mod team has been stacked full of yes men.  

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Winter, allow me to speak to you in the language of your people, if I may. The case between Shard and Enguin might possess incidental similarities, but that's all they are, incidental similarities. Shard, from what I understand, was deliberately trying to get himself banned, and he achieved that mission. Enguin might just have been the same really, but here's the thing: Enguin just got off a ban.

 

Temporary bans are all about a time-out to get you to reflect on your actions, and maybe make a change to be a better member. The second Enguin got back he proved that he hadn't changed one bit. But we didn't hold it against him; what we did hold against him however was that he just got off a ban, and we'd be scrutinizing him just like one would with someone who had a sentence commuted for parole. Enguin was being watched to observe his actions, and today was merely the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

You might not be aware of this given your own ban that you only recently got off Winter, but Enguin has presented a host of toxic actions around the site that has resulted in many, many warns before. And yet he kept doing what he did, merely tip-toeing the line of bannable offences while wearing his warning points with pride. He is no angel by any stretch of the imagination, but he had been granted far more leniency than he had ever deserved. Today, Enguin crossed the line, and he violated the last scrap of good grace the mod team had for him. Believe you me there is no love lost between the mods and Enguin, that much is certain, but it doesn't change that what he did was very much not okay.

 

He is someone who has wasted chance upon chance upon chance upon chance, and given this was, as I said, post-ban, he successfully wasted his last chance. He knew what he was doing was wrong, but he did it anyways, simply because he could. If it was something in the rules, which is doesn't need too because what he was doing violated common sense, he'd have ignored it anyways and still done it. Enguin doesn't want to change. He doesn't want to be anything else beyond what he is. And now, he can be himself far away from YCM, where he can't bother/offend/insult anyone anymore.

 

I'm sorry if it offends you that you weren't notified well in-advance (in triplicate) so you can okay every our decision, but the fact is is that this wasn't your decision to make. Enguin was a problem. It is the job of the mods to deal with problems. You might not like it, but Enguin crossed a line today. A line written in the sand many decades ago. He violated his parole Winter, and as a firm believer of the judicial system, I'm sure you must understand our actions when it comes to a parole violation.

The line that Zai was perfectly cheery to cross? You really like drawing lines where convenient and then telling people to sit down. Show me the the man, and you'll find the crime. 

 

You can be as condescending as you want, but that doesn't mask that what Enguin did today was anything out of the accepted norm (you can debate that it should be a norm if you want). It's not for you to like X member, or even tolerate them. There are clear rules to be followed, and if you don't have the patience to do that and instead feel the need to draw new lines to suit your needs. You shouldn't be a mod. 

 

I love how you assume that I've not noticed anything going on here. Last thing Enguin was banned for was his "enguin engs" thread

 

And that was for 5 days. Do tell me how you're following the temp ban schedule

 

As a firm believer in a judicial system I know an ex post facto law and fishing investigation when I see one. Also, I'm hardly the only person who's unhappy about this. 

 

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Anyone can read the Enguin Engs thread...there's hostility towards Enguin from more than 1 mod Flame

[Flame Dragon]

Well now some holocaust jokes are ok, and others aren't. The point to be made here is that a user should not be punished or banned for an activity that a mod gleefully took part in

 

Yeh see that's the same bullshit answer Evil gave too. I don't wanna deal with winter anymore, so I'm just gonna ignore the rest of he ban schedule and just go for the perma (I needed 6 months off for personal reasons, but Koko's question of "why now" was never answered then either)

 

Enguin was banned by Sakura, and he had a thread critical of him. The thread was then edited to remove the references critical of sakura. 

 

That's also not shocking. The mod team has been stacked full of yes men.

No, they all aren't ok. You are asking me why Zai went along with it, but I can't answer that question. I already said he was wrong to do so. I don't know what you want from me on this point? The fact that of the matter is this is from 9 month ago and unless it was REALLY over the line or something I'm not going to warn anyone over anything after that period.

 

You are certainly right that this is similar to what happened to you. Again, why I'm questioning if this should have been a permeant ban.

 

Does who it was that banned him matter? Again, we came to an agreement and any one of us could have done it. The only disagreement of any kind was questioning how long it should be and a statement about disliking permanent bans.

 

Anyone can read the Enguin Engs thread...there's hostility towards Enguin from more than 1 mod Flame

I was either in the wrong thread or SUPER blind but the only mods I saw post were Yui, Night, and Evil and two of them enjoyed it. Two of them also aren't mods anymore and one didn't comment before the ban was made.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

No, they all aren't ok. You are asking me why Zai went along with it, but I can't answer that question. I already said he was wrong to do so. I don't know what you want from me on this point? The fact that of the matter is this is from 9 month ago and unless it was REALLY over the line or something I'm not going to warn anyone over anything after that period.

 

You are certainly right that this is similar to what happened to you. Again, why I'm questioning if this should have been a permeant ban.

 

Does who it was that banned him matter? Again, we came to an agreement and any one of us could have done it. The only disagreement of any kind was questioning how long it should be and a statement about disliking permanent bans.

I'm not asking you to answer for Zai's comments. I'm telling you it's not fair to punish a guy for following an example the mods have exemplified and tolerated before. I'm not asking you to ban x or y over it. 

 

Well I needed 6 months off. My grades sucked, I had both a drug addiction and depression, then my father fell gravely ill. I'd question exactly what I did at the time that made me ripe for a perma (last thread I posted in was shard thread about discourse), but I appreciated the time off anyway

 

I'm still not sure why it should have been a ban at all. Point (1). Perma is in no way warranted, but if we're going from a 5 day ban for "Enguin Engs" to a perma for this...I'm not sure why we even need rules. You (the mod team) are basically gerrymandering rules to get rid of people you personally dislike. 

 

Yeah it does. If people who have repeatedly butted heads with him and have a personal feud banned him, there is a significant conflict of interest. Hell Evil made it a point to ban him himself to try to bunt this very critique. 

 

Might be cowcow's disagreement

 

mine are more numerous

 

(1) ban length (should be 0)

(2) permas are inherently flawed

 

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(3) making rules on the fly to excise people

(4) not following existing rules cause don't wanna

(5) then trash talking members as if it's their fault (1-4) happened

(6) same pt I made to deadpool and Zai, Holocaust jokes are not personally funny for me, but neither of them should be punished for it. Same with Enguin. If there is to be a debate on the banning of certain types of speech, we should have a forum wide discussion over it

 

(7) the mod team once again was jumpy and draconian. At some point it stops becoming anecdotes and is a pattern

 

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Hey Broke. N, thanks for egging my face. When a number of other people said you were impulsive, condescending, and a prick. I said we should give you a trial period and that "that side" of you wasn't what we should judge you on. Thanks for just being more of the same "trust big brother, it concerns not you peasants" as the rest of the team and making me look gullible and stupid.

I was either in the wrong thread or SUPER blind but the only mods I saw post were Yui, Night, and Evil and two of them enjoyed it. Two of them also aren't mods anymore and one didn't comment before the ban was made.

Yui made numerous comments about how the mod team disliked Enguin as a whole, implying it was more than just him

 

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I'm tired, frustrated, and a little angry right now Flame. And it's 3 AM. I'll respond in the morning

[Flame Dragon]

I'm not asking you to answer for Zai's comments. I'm telling you it's not fair to punish a guy for following an example the mods have exemplified and tolerated before. I'm not asking you to ban x or y over it.

And I'm telling you it wasn't acceptable for him to just go with it. Because someone handled a situation wrong doesn't mean we should keep doing it.

 

 

I'm still not sure why it should have been a ban at all. Point (1). Perma is in no way warranted, but if we're going from a 5 day ban for "Enguin Engs" to a perma for this...I'm not sure why we even need rules. You (the mod team) are basically gerrymandering rules to get rid of people you personally dislike. 

 

Yeah it does. If people who have repeatedly butted heads with him and have a personal feud banned him, there is a significant conflict of interest. Hell Evil made it a point to ban him himself to try to bunt this very critique.

I don't think I personally dislike anyone. In fact, I'd argue I can at least talk to most the members. Closest I come is when I get sick of us constantly going "Member X is a problem". Full disclosure that likely happened with you for me because it just kept coming up and I wanted it to stop. That can certainly cause bias, but I don't think that happened here for me.

 

(3) making rules on the fly to excise people

(5) then trash talking members as if it's their fault (1-4) happened

(6) same pt I made to deadpool and Zai, Holocaust jokes are not personally funny for me, but neither of them should be punished for it. Same with Enguin. If there is to be a debate on the banning of certain types of speech, we should have a forum wide discussion over it

(7) the mod team once again was jumpy and draconian. At some point it stops becoming anecdotes and is a pattern

 

Yui made numerous comments about how the mod team disliked Enguin as a whole, implying it was more than just him

3) We didn't think we need to quantify hate speech. We are working on a rule about hate speech now.

5) I assume you mean the various mod reaction in thread? I'd assume that is a result of this being a constant dance and it getting old. That is a different issue though.

6) We both believe there is a line that someone can cross for that type of speech. Personally "A second Holocaust? When was the first?" cross that line.

7) As said, we are often too hasty in how we react. That is an issue.

 

I didn't read the thread so I didn't see that. Just looked for mod posts. Yui wasn't speaking for me at the very least.

[~~~~]

It honestly feels like winter/cowcow/hina are trying to get Enguin off on a technicality - that maybe he didn't fully cross some line, or maybe the mods didn't handle his case with full procedure. But the thing is that the mods aren't just the perfectly obedient arm of the very imperfect site rules, they are human and able to recognise when someone is breaking the spirit of the rules, as Enguin did for virtually his entire tenure on the site, even if they are very skilled in technically not breaking the rules.

 

Your job as a moderator is not first to make the place comfortable. Just attests to the intellectual cuckery plaguing the place. Your job as a moderator is first to competently grant the rules real-world power with objectivity and impartiality. Comfort afterwards is a mere luxury, especially considering all this cognitive dissonance.

This is pure bullshit because the rules are there to make sure this site stays comfortable, enjoyable and safe. And in Enguin's case they were clearly failing to do so since he should have been banned ages ago.

 

I'd also like to comment that Enguin did also recently make a status saying that Jews are not human.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

And I'm telling you it wasn't acceptable for him to just go with it. Because someone handled a situation wrong doesn't mean we should keep doing it.

 

 

 

I don't think I personally dislike anyone. In fact, I'd argue I can at least talk to most the members. Closest I come is when I get sick of us constantly going "Member X is a problem". Full disclosure that likely happened with you for me because it just kept coming up and I wanted it to stop. That can certainly cause bias, but I don't think that happened here for me.

 

 

3) We didn't think we need to quantify hate speech. We are working on a rule about hate speech now.

5) I assume you mean the various mod reaction in thread? I'd assume that is a result of this being a constant dance and it getting old. That is a different issue though.

6) We both believe there is a line that someone can cross for that type of speech. Personally "A second Holocaust? When was the first?" cross that line.

7) As said, we are often too hasty in how we react. That is an issue.

 

I didn't read the thread so I didn't see that. Just looked for mod posts. Yui wasn't speaking for me at the very least.

1) This isn't some random user, this is a mod who is supposed to be an example

 

2) And that's not right, you don't get to throw someone under just because you're tired of them. You have to follow the rules regardless. Even if you didn't feel this type of resentment, Yui's post shows that others did. And the title edit show it too

 

3) What you consider hate speech might not be universal. Surely this was apparent after numerous conflicts between Roxas and myself

 

5) Much like 3, that's not an excuse. If you can't deal with it, resign. We're not here to cuddle the mod team

 

6) And that's a more arbitrary line than my line of threatening harm to actual people. Shard's comments clearly crossed that line. It's not at all apparent Enguin's did

It honestly feels like winter/cowcow/hina are trying to get Enguin off on a technicality - that maybe he didn't fully cross some line, or maybe the mods didn't handle his case with full procedure. But the thing is that the mods aren't just the perfectly obedient arm of the very imperfect site rules, they are human and able to recognise when someone is breaking the spirit of the rules, as Enguin did for virtually his entire tenure on the site, even if they are very skilled in technically not breaking the rules.

 

This is pure bullshit because the rules are there to make sure this site stays comfortable, enjoyable and safe. And in Enguin's case they were clearly failing to do so since he should have been banned ages ago.

 

I'd also like to comment that Enguin did also recently make a status saying that Jews are not human.

Yeah, that's like saying I got off on a technicality. Banning people on the "spirit" of rules is basically saying the mods can ban anyone they dislike. Maybe that's what your for, but I'm not for unilateral unaccountable power like that

 

Please tell me why Enguin gets to stay banned, but Zai and Snatch don't. What about Hina's point about Dad's lexicon? Am I next in line for the chop block if I criticize Islam?

[Dad]

TIL me saying jabroni is equivalent to mocking the death of millions of innocents. If this is true, it's just one more reason I should advocate in favor of his ban.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

TIL me saying jabroni is equivalent to mocking the death of millions of innocents. If this is true, it's just one more reason I should advocate in favor of his ban.

Is this a bad attempt at a strawman?

 

They're both ridiculous. Clearly you're not advocating for slavery or the segregation of Blacks, just as there's not a shred of proof that Enguin was advocating or cheering on the massacre of millions. 

[Tourmaline]

 

This is pure bullshit because the rules are there to make sure this site stays comfortable, enjoyable and safe. And in Enguin's case they were clearly failing to do so since he should have been banned ages ago.

 

I'd also like to comment that Enguin did also recently make a status saying that Jews are not human.

 

wut 

I said enforcing the rules is the primary duty of a moderator. Comfort thereafter becomes a relevant concern because nobody will participate in a contract where they're miserable. 

 

 

TIL me saying jabroni is equivalent to mocking the death of millions of innocents. If this is true, it's just one more reason I should advocate in favor of his ban.

Within the quoted post's it's worth punishment.

[Dad]

wut 

I said enforcing the rules is the primary duty of a moderator. Comfort thereafter becomes a relevant concern because nobody will participate in a contract where they're miserable. 

 

 

Within the quoted post's it's worth punishment.

So you agree with me. Or do you somehow understand what i said better than i do?

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

I found where Enguin's member title is from

 

 

Banworthy for sure. Another day, another attempt by the mod team to become a meme

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

So you agree with me. Or do you somehow understand what i said better than i do?

Who cares, you guys have claimed power to understand Enguin's intent better than him. Surely you should be held to the same standard? Then again, maybe not *glares at Zai*

[Dad]

Who cares, you guys have claimed power to understand Enguin's intent better than him. Surely you should be held to the same standard? Then again, maybe not *glares at Zai*

What's the difference between me banning ducks and genocide?

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Ducks being allow to make and laugh at Deadpools off colored holocaust jokes seems to be the main one