Cards banned for long time, recommended erratas

[EndUser]

These are cards that may actually be ok to leave the banlist (imo) if they follow the erratas below. I'm not saying they should definitely be edited, but just recommending ways to do so.
The cards included have been banned both in TCG and OCG for so many years. Also, I cite my views on my choices for each one. Some of them needed just a twist; others needed more than just one addition.

You must have noticed that there are only few of them. The ones I didn't include were those for which
a) I didn't know what to suggest,
b) wasn't sure if they do need an errata or
c) it's impossible to do it either because they simply can't be fixed or they would need too many changes, rendering them useless.



[spoiler=Yata-Garasu]Cannot be Special Summoned. This card returns to its owner's hand during the End Phase of the turn it is Normal Summoned or flipped face-up. When this card inflicts Battle Damage to your opponent, they skip their next Draw Phase. If they do, they draw 2 cards during their next End Phase.

[spoiler=Info]No matter what limitations it has, skipping the Draw Phase can't be fixed. Therefore, I chose simply to give the opponent a late, but powerful draw help. For them to take damage from Yata, either they are already in great disadvantage or the player has used too many resources to do the play successfully. In either case, giving them any help during their turn basically renders Yata's purpose useless, so yeah.

 

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[spoiler=Pot of Greed]Draw 2 cards, then reveal your hand (min. 4). If you do, you cannot draw other cards until the end of your opponent's next turn.

[spoiler=Info](This is a tough one. In general, I'm still skeptical about it.)
In the early days of the game, there was barely (if even) any decent draw/search power other than PoG and Graceful Charity. I errata'd PoG in that sense, by giving the player a free +1 but by not allowing them to draw any more cards. They can still search as much as they want, though. Preventing this too would be stupid, however the player has to reveal their hand. Even if they search cards, the other player would still know what's going on (because the searched cards are always known). Let me give some reasons why PoG wouldn't be that scary:

1) Statistically speaking (sorry if I'm wrong), unless a Deck actually relies on drawing cards or the player uses a First Turn Spam/Lock etc deck (the Quasar decks are the most famous example of it), the other decks mostly search. Therefore, drawing or not makes little to no difference, except that the opponent usually has no idea what is drawn. My errata changes this.
2) It's a free +1, no doubt. Everyone can abuse it. However: Player goes first; they establish a powerful field. Player goes 2nd; the opponent will either be well fortified or too weak to even make a difference with the extra draw.
3) The thing with revealing the hand is to let the opponent know both what you drew and to make them aware of what you may have wanted to keep a secret from them or the cards you'd Set. The reason you need to reveal at least 4 cards is to not go "play all/set all, then draw and opponent still knows barely anything".

 

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[spoiler=Graceful Charity]Draw 3 cards, then discard 2 cards. You cannot activate effects from your Graveyard or target cards in your Graveyard the turn you activate this card. You can only activate 1 "Graceful Charity" per turn."

[spoiler=Info]Somewhat, the same logic with PoG, as in "how Yugioh was played back then". The differences to my errata are based on the card's applications. Not much to say here, since the effect is self-explanatory.

 

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[spoiler=Dimension Fusion]Activate only if your opponent has at least the same number of banished monsters as you. Pay 2000 Life Points. Both players Special Summon as many of their banished monsters as possible. The monsters that are Special Summoned by this effect are banished instead of being sent to your Graveyard.

[spoiler=Info]Even if your Deck can abuse banishing cards, even if your archetype is based on banishing: If your opponent cannot gain the same advantage to you, then the card is useless. Also, notice that it says "your Graveyard" at the end, not "the Graveyard", to banish only your monsters if sent to the Graveyard.

 

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[spoiler=Mass Driver]Tribute 1 monster on your side of the field to inflict 400 points of damage to your opponent's Life Points. Destroy this card if your opponent has 3000 or less Life Points.

[spoiler=Info]Aside from OTK'ing the opponent, I personally can't see more use to this card than what other cards can do & offer to most decks nowadays. Therefore, I simply added a restriction to how much one can abuse it.

 

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[spoiler=Mirage of Nightmare]Once per turn, during your opponent's Standby Phase: Draw cards until you have 4 cards in your hand. If you do, you can only use 1 effect that activates in your hand during that turn, also, during your next Standby Phase after that: Shuffle the same number of cards you drew into your Deck (or your entire hand, if you do not have enough cards).

[spoiler=Info]2 or less, the card would be meaningful. 3 or 4, I added a limitation to prevent excessive hand plays. Moreover, during your following turn, you don't discard cards but shuffle them back into the deck. I know this makes the cards inconvenient to use, but it does offer two things:
1) a potential newly-added card (remember that you shuffle cards equal to the draw, NOT your entire hand) and
2) a small chance to prevent the opponent from going too far with their plays.

 

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[spoiler=Card of Safe Return]Once per turn, during your turn, when a monster is Special Summoned from your Graveyard: You can draw 1 card.

[spoiler=Info]Not much to say. It's simple & not abusive. However, notice that it says "during your turn", not simply during either player's turn.

 

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[spoiler=Butterfly Dagger - Elma]The equipped monster gains 300 ATK. When this card is destroyed and sent to the Graveyard while equipped: You can return this card to the hand during the End Phase, but you cannot activate it until the end of the next turn.

[spoiler=Info]So... FTK/OTK locks/plays anyone? Not any more.
The reason you can't activate it basically for two turns if returned to your hand is because it's similar to Sinister Serpent (which was errata'd for the same reason): You can reuse it at no cost, either from your hand or on the field.

 

[zepheris]

Yata garasu might come back with that but it'd be useless... If you really want your opponent to skip his draw phase, just use soul devouring bamboo sword. Sure, it's a bit difficult to do, but I've done yata lock with it before and yata would honestly be half useless without the yata lock anyway. The draw during the end phase is just too much for it to stay useful. It's not like anyone's breaking down the door to use yata anyway...

 

I actually want to disagree on Pot of greed. The reason's tied to nostalgia and the traditional format (Where banned cards are limited). I don't really want Pot, graceful charity, monster reborn, HFD, cyber jar, fiber jar or CED back... I didn't want future fusion or sinister serpent either, but... Other than that, with the errata, I do think it'd come back, and be useful too, I'd use it.

 

I think the same thing applies to graceful as above. Also, I think it'd still be incredibly useful unless you use a deck that loves the grave and can't do without. Even then you could just wait until M2 to use it. I think it might still be banned after the errata.

 

"Pay 2000 LP. Your opponent Special Summons as many of their banished monsters as possible. Then you can special summon as many of your banished monsters as possible, up to the number summoned by your opponent. The monsters that are Special Summoned by this effect are banished instead of being sent to your Graveyard."

Because honestly, having the same number of banished cards almost never happens. You could almost never use the card. If you just want to limit both players to summoning the same amount, then this is fine.

 

You know, I don't think mass driver should stay banned even with its current effect. Just look at cannon soldier. The only reason mass driver is banned instead of cannon soldier is that it doesn't limit your normal summon, so a simple errata of 'you can't normal summon the turn you activate this card' would be enough without making the card totally useless...

 

How are you planning to use these effects anyway(Other than hand traps) during your opponent's turn? I don't mind either effect, actually, and despite how OP it seems at a glance, the old effect isn't all that great to begin with, since it's a -1 when activated, and it's too slow to cycle too many cards, especially with TT going around everywhere, and even among monsters, they have so many spell spot removal... The card's alright after the erratta, but everyone's going to use magical mallet instead (Not like anyone uses MM). It'd just be a slightly better version of card trader.

 

Safe return is fine, no comments on that.

 

No comment on elma

[EndUser]

Ok, that's some interesting feedback.

I'll share my views on what you said, following the order of the cards like you did:

 

Yata: The opinions vary. There are those who think people will attempt to use Yata to lock games and others who think that it's too slow for the current gamestate.

I don't pick an exact side, but felt I could add something that could possibly cease any opposite views.

 

PoG: Fair enough. That's how you feel about it. However, I like that you are positive with the errata.

 

Graceful Charity: <Even then you could just wait until M2 to use it.> My errata doesn't say anything about Phases; it's about the entire turn.

 

Dimension Fusion: I like your version. Thing is, I tried to keep the cards' originality as intact as possible, but yeah.

 

Mass Driver: Not allowing the player to Normal Summon for the turn is too restrictive for the card. The problem with the card is mostly any potential OTKs; no need to punish the player hard for something that may not even reach the goal (esp. if they go 2nd). So basically, a limit to its abuse is just enough.

 

Mirage of Nightmare:

<the old effect isn't all that great to begin with>

The card was fine many years before, because the Graveyard was almost irrelevant back then. Then Chaos decks/Dark Worlds/etc. etc. appeared. Keep in mind that MoN discards so here, Fabled as a bonus. Also, can you imagine it been used nowadays? Name at least 10 decks that were topping the last 3 or 5 years that wouldn't like to use MoN. Graveyard setup, effects activations, Psyframes (dunno if it's possible though), decks that optimize hand traps, and the list goes on.

 

<it's too slow to cycle too many cards, especially with TT going around everywhere>

Yes, it's the cost you have to pay for the benefits it retains.

a) Worst case scenario, assuming the card is still in play, you had a look at the top 1,2,3 or 4 cards of the Deck and keep the most useful of them.

b) Best case scenario,... Bujin/Blackwings/LIGHT decks with high chances of drawing Honest/Crane/Kalut, generally hand traps ready to be unleashed, abused Fabled Hand Control Style, Monarchs/True Draco ready for Tribute Summoning, Shaddolls along with "El-shad fusion"... and other stuff I can't think of right now.

Now, imagine most of that if I didn't limit the card to 1 effect from the hand. Let alone, if you discard during the following turn instead of shuffling cards into the Deck.

 

Hm, I just remembered Future Fusion. In terms of beneficial turn, it's similar to my version of MoN because both cards have to wait for 1 turn. Difference is, FF can be used during your next turn, while MoN can benefit you both during the following & your next turn.

 

<The card's alright after the erratta, but everyone's going to use magical mallet instead>

Yeah, it tries to keep its usage but also reduces the risk of abuse a lot. Also, it may look like MM is indeed the better option here, but the card still has some uses; like I said, I tried to make it playable by diminishing the abuse of it.

[zepheris]

I admit I misread Graceful charity. I read it as "rest of the turn", which it's not. My bad.

 

The problem with your version of mass driver is just that nobody cares about the burn, unless it's able to kill. Just damage doesn't matter, otherwise the solemn cards wouldn't be so good. I would rather use a mass driver that could kill, with a small cost, rather than one that can't kill at all. In fact, just releasing it outright wouldn't be that bad, as the combos with it are generally inconsistent anyway. Either errata, I think cannon soldier would be better for otks. Even when Chicken game and upstart were at 3, and I was playing traditional (I miss DN so much.) with the cannon hedgehog loop, I didn't use this card. Toon CS is searchable, and the xyz loop is usable with him, while I absolutely needed IIW for mass driver, and IIW bricked my hands, and eventually, I removed MD altogether. It's not as good as it might seem. It might be a good finisher though, like ring of destruction, but by limiting it from being used at the endgame, it just becomes useless.

 

I feel that MON (As is) would be good, not broken. Truthfully, it wouldn't last for that many turns with the amount of removal we have. Although its hard to tell, because of the lack of continuous cards in general, but a lot of the decks I've played with have experienced the pain of losing the continuous cards constantly. It'd stay for one, maybe 2 turns, then it'd be popped. Twin twisters should never have been released. I hate and love that card, depending on who's got it...  I do think that decks with tons of hand traps could abuse the card, but making you shuffle the cards into the deck is just unnecessarily bad. At best, it's just an upgraded version of card trader, and MM does most of the things this card could do. Both are -1, both allow you to trade cards in your hand for draws, ending up with the same number as you had, MM is usable immediately, cannot be popped, there's no card limit and the cards drawn have no limitations. On the other hand, new MON is reusable, and allows you a bit more choice on which cards to shuffle. 

The benefits of having a bit more choice in draws aren't as good as they may seem on paper. The card cycling is good, don't get me wrong here, there's a reason card destruction is banned, but ever since DW stopped being super relevant, I think MON (Original) would be tolerable. I feel like a lot of the cards on the banlist are like this. Once the decks that abused them stopped being as relevant, I think they should come back, at least as limited cards. Morphing jar (1 and 2. Why was 2 even banned? The only decks that ever used it were mill decks, and those are super relevant, right guys?) Card destruction, Zenmaity, time seal, (Wait, vanity's is banned? I am so not with the times here... Ultimate offering too... and kaiser, when did these cards get banned?), stratos, towers, grandsoil, shurit, that one shaddoll fusion card, monster reborn, trap dustshoot, and maybe self destruct button. These cards, if limited, wouldn't be broken. Of course, MJ#2 should be taken off the banlist completely. Who uses that thing?

 

As a side note, I compared the list with OCG, and they have so many cards... They have CED at 3, towers at 3, stratos at 2, Tribe infecting virus, djinn at 3, both morphing jars, shurit, cyberstien, Excition at 3, avarice at 2, card destruction, monster reborn, super rejuvenation, kaiser colloseum at 3, chicken game and SDB at 3. They even have feather duster! FEATHER DUSTER! If they just had cyber jar, I could make my old, traditional deck out deck legally...

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

(And that's why you hear a certain user going on about how the OCG format is better than what we have, to much chagrin from other members at times... Moving on...)

 

Pot of Greed is technically fine, since it does block other draw effects and eliminates the need to hard OPT it; you technically did. 

 

Card of Safe Return is fine, especially with Konami making Decks that literally spam from the GY nowadays. It's still a free draw, but least not 3-5 or something. 

 

I have to agree with Mass Driver, as otherwise it's still functionally the same, bar for the self-destruct clause after 3K. 

 

Butterfly Dagger should probably be okay now, since the looping potential is cut down. Then again, Guardian Elma got shafted due to her equip getting the axe for degeneracy. 

 

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P.S. Vanity's got banned a few lists ago; Kaiser was probably April/July 2017 TCG list (either 0 or 3 and blame Bujins or something iirc). 

[zepheris]

Update, Mirage is banned because, if it's destroyed before you discard, you don't have to discard. You could go +4 for nothing. The errata doesn't fix that, so...