[RESULTS ARE FINAL] 2016 Election for President of the United States | Donald Trump Victory

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

They're not a scoundrel, as long as it's legal, they're just being resourceful. Like Trump said, if you have a problem with it, change the laws. HRC has been here for 30 years, where's she been? Blowing Bill?

Trumps biggest mistakes was being a prideful ass on Birtherism and being too defensive on his buisness. Just ask her when's the last time she multiplied her wealth by a thousand. That would have shut her up

[vla1ne]

So when someone rich avoids paying tax in a legal fashion it's okay because 'they've earned it by exploiting the system', but if someone poor legally abuses the system to get benefits say they are a scoundrel? The answer should be no, neither situation is fair to those who actually abide by the intention of the system - I.E. you pay the government a fair share of tax and you don't abuse the system. It's actually worse in case of the rich because they would be contributing more than the poor man is taking. 

 

It's not really a matter of legality as much as it is one of ethics. It is not ethical for the president of the United states to not be paying his fair share of taxes, and certainty not to brag about it.

 

The money management argument to me is a double-standard that shouldn't exist. Especially for the rich because when you earn that much you can actually afford to pay your goddam taxes without impacting QoL. 

it's not that they've earned it, it's that the tools are there to do such, and they chose to use those tools. if there's loopholes, people will use them, poor, rich, doesn't matter. welfare has loopholes that you see abused every day, the only thing that makes the loopholes in the rich any different is that they only work at higher status, while things like welfare only work on the lower status. they both need to be fixed, but they're both legit until then. those on welfare pay far fewer taxes, and i know people who could damn sure work, but abuse the conditions of welfare for a free ride. the system's whats broken, not the people who take advantage of the glitches.

 

gotta agree there, there's no ethical argument to be made on the subject.

 

it does though, and for decent if not good reason. sure, you can, but most already pay more than the next hundred citizens combined (if not next thousand), it's not completely wrong to say they're already paying their fair share, even after most loopholes. (of course, those who hit zero on their tax rates are a bit different, but the point stands) they already pay enough to cover hundreds, if not thousands of other citizens, why is it so wrong that they'd want to save a bit more of what they make?

 

 

 

 

 

They're not a scoundrel, as long as it's legal, they're just being resourceful. Like Trump said, if you have a problem with it, change the laws. HRC has been here for 30 years, where's she been? Blowing Bill?

legality doesn't make them not a scoundrel. it does make them not an idiot. like it or not, if they can save money within the confines of the law, theye more than likely gonna do it. also, a bit too far there mate. 

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

it's not that they've earned it, it's that the tools are there to do such, and they chose to use those tools. if there's loopholes, people will use them, poor, rich, doesn't matter. welfare has loopholes that you see abused every day, the only thing that makes the loopholes in the rich any different is that they only work at higher status, while things like welfare only work on the lower status. they both need to be fixed, but they're both legit until then. those on welfare pay far fewer taxes, and i know people who could damn sure work, but abuse the conditions of welfare for a free ride. the system's whats broken, not the people who take advantage of the glitches.

 

gotta agree there, there's no ethical argument to be made on the subject.

 

it does though, and for decent if not good reason. sure, you can, but most already pay more than the next hundred citizens combined (if not next thousand), it's not completely wrong to say they're already paying their fair share, even after most loopholes. (of course, those who hit zero on their tax rates are a bit different, but the point stands) they already pay enough to cover hundreds, if not thousands of other citizens, why is it so wrong that they'd want to save a bit more of what they make?

 

 

 

 

 

 

legality doesn't make them not a scoundrel. it does make them not an idiot. like it or not, if they can save money within the confines of the law, theye more than likely gonna do it. also, a bit too far there mate.

 

I just don't see what's wrong with trying to succede in life....scoundrel in my eyes is the Ambassador scandal or the Clinton or apperently Trump foundations. Illegal but hard to prove so. This is available for everyone to use, hardly Trump's fault they dont

[vla1ne]

I just don't see what's wrong with trying to succede in life....scoundrel in my eyes is the Ambassador scandal or the Clinton or apperently Trump foundations. Illegal but hard to prove so. This is available for everyone to use, hardly Trump's fault they dont

they've already succeeded, for the most part, this is them wanting to keep some of that success in their pockets (understandable, you get a billion, why would you want to give it away to people you don't know, or a government that's already doing diddly with the money you've given them). the fact that these tools are at all available for abuse (rich or poor), is the problem. the fact that a healthy person can make it almost all the way through life solely on other people's tax dollars, or that billionaire have enough tools to doge over 75% of their taxes, is the problem, it's not their fault for taking advantage of it, that's human nature, but somebody's gotta have the brains to step in and fix the loopholes in the first place. you don't blame the player, you ban the spellbook of judgement.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

And HRC has been here for 30 years, yet Sanders has done more to call out loopholes this year than she has her whole adult life. She has no ground to stand upon. That lady is Jowgen. Riding SBJ till she can, then acting like she's not at fault if we're gonna go with YGO analogies

 

Hell Trump in the 90's was more anti loophole than her

[Aerion Brightflame]

it's not that they've earned it, it's that the tools are there to do such, and they chose to use those tools. if there's loopholes, people will use them, poor, rich, doesn't matter. welfare has loopholes that you see abused every day, the only thing that makes the loopholes in the rich any different is that they only work at higher status, while things like welfare only work on the lower status. they both need to be fixed, but they're both legit until then. those on welfare pay far fewer taxes, and i know people who could damn sure work, but abuse the conditions of welfare for a free ride. the system's whats broken, not the people who take advantage of the glitches.

 

it does though, and for decent if not good reason. sure, you can, but most already pay more than the next hundred citizens combined (if not next thousand), it's not completely wrong to say they're already paying their fair share, even after most loopholes. (of course, those who hit zero on their tax rates are a bit different, but the point stands) they already pay enough to cover hundreds, if not thousands of other citizens, why is it so wrong that they'd want to save a bit more of what they make?

Well the other argument is that only the rich can use the loopholes because only the rich can afford the lawyers who can point the loopholes out. But I agree the fault is with the system rather than the people - The issue is, you shouldn't boast about abusing the system, you should aim to fix it instead. It's entirely the wrong message to go 'Well our system is horrible and we need to fix it. But on the other hand, look at how clever I am for abusing this broken system and benefiting from it'. 

 

My argument would be that for the people whose tax cover hundreds or thousands of other citizens is that the money they avoid being taxed on isn't money they'll use. Because they have so much anyway. If say you were paying 30% on a Billion Dollars gross income (Your person, so no business expenses involved here), and you save 10% and only actually pay 20, you've saved yourself a cool 100 million... But is that extra 100 million really that big of a difference to your lifestyle? You already have 700 million whatever happens, you are going to be living a life of luxury. That extra money you save is just extravagance that they'll probably never use. I know this is kinda slippery logic because you can define anything beyond 4 walls, a roof, cloths and food as extravagance, but you understand that there is simply a point where more wealth just is unnecessary because you physically can't spend it. And those are the people who do dodge these taxes the most because they can afford the lawyers to show them the loops. 

 

Essentially my argument is just based in the ethical standpoint of one should be willing to contribute to society, and that the spirit of the tax laws should outweigh the actual technicality of it. As should be the case with almost any law tbh. 

 

Part of the issue of course comes from the fact that those writing the laws usually benefit from them due to personal wealth, and thus putting loopholes in is self-serving. But that's just one of the intrinsic issues with some modern democratic systems.  

[vla1ne]

And HRC has been here for 30 years, yet Sanders has done more to call out loopholes this year than she has her whole adult life. She has no ground to stand upon. That lady is Jowgen. Riding SBJ till she can, then acting like she's not at fault if we're gonna go with YGO analogies

 

Hell Trump in the 90's was more anti loophole than her

well, unfortunately, benie's gone, so it's beween her, trump.

 

i know i keep harping on it, but damn, he wasted so many potential shots at her (and likewise from her towards him). like dad said, this is literally a race to see who shoots themselves the most. luckily, he actually gained something from the debates tonight, apparently people expected worse thanks to mainstream media and he surpassed their expectations. i for one, expected better. his lack of self control is seriously gonna hurt him badly if he keeps this up, he's gotta push himself to keep his composure far more than he's doing.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

No I fully agree with you. I give Trump a 4/10 and HRC a 3.5/10 and HRC+Holt a 4/10

 

It was a clown show and a clusterfuck

 

But apperently he snagged a few independents off it, so w/e

[vla1ne]

Well the other argument is that only the rich can use the loopholes because only the rich can afford the lawyers who can point the loopholes out. But I agree the fault is with the system rather than the people - The issue is, you shouldn't boast about abusing the system, you should aim to fix it instead. It's entirely the wrong message to go 'Well our system is horrible and we need to fix it. But on the other hand, look at how clever I am for abusing this broken system and benefiting from it'. 

 

My argument would be that for the people whose tax cover hundreds or thousands of other citizens is that the money they avoid being taxed on isn't money they'll use. Because they have so much anyway. If say you were paying 30% on a Billion Dollars gross income (Your person, so no business expenses involved here), and you save 10% and only actually pay 20, you've saved yourself a cool 100 million... But is that extra 100 million really that big of a difference to your lifestyle? You already have 700 million whatever happens, you are going to be living a life of luxury. That extra money you save is just extravagance that they'll probably never use. I know this is kinda slippery logic because you can define anything beyond 4 walls, a roof, cloths and food as extravagance, but you understand that there is simply a point where more wealth just is unnecessary because you physically can't spend it. And those are the people who do dodge these taxes the most because they can afford the lawyers to show them the loops. 

 

Essentially my argument is just based in the ethical standpoint of one should be willing to contribute to society, and that the spirit of the tax laws should outweigh the actual technicality of it. As should be the case with almost any law tbh. 

 

Part of the issue of course comes from the fact that those writing the laws usually benefit from them due to personal wealth, and thus putting loopholes in is self-serving. But that's just one of the intrinsic issues with some modern democratic systems.

he is arguing to change said loopholes it's words for now, but the opposition has had enough time to do so, or at least heavily push for it, and still hasn't. him bragging about it was because they kept calling him out on it. almost every mention of his tax records was started by the moderator or hillary. his firing back unapologetically was the second best choice he could have made (the absolute best would have been to fire back on the Clinton foundation, Benghazi, the rape defense stories,ect.). had he backed down on it, not only would he have looked far weaker, but he'd have been browbeaten over it for the remainder of the debate. him claiming he's smart for using available loopholes is legit smart.

 

 

as for him not using it, the argument could be made that his children, his childrens' children, and so-on and so-forth, will, AKA, the legacy argument. against that, you could say that his kids wouldn't need so much, but then if you look at the estate tax, you can see that as the law is now, they're gonna be getting at his money, one way or another. saving it now, while he's alive to find said loopholes, is rather smart. i have no idea if that's his train of thought, but that's a legit defense if it is, and even if it isn't his train of though, it still applies.

 

he's already (i assume) contributing. if he's donating what he says he does, and that's the main interest i have in his taxes, to see if hes doing as much charity as he claims. the spirit of tax laws can be countered by the spirit of charity, but i do get the feeling he's bullshitting in that area.

 

i have no arguments against that.

[Dad]

http://www.dailydot.com/layer8/trump-clinton-debate-online-polls-4chan-the-donald/

 

 

This better be bullshit. Because with screen shots I'm really annoyed reasing this. Not that online polls are reliable anyway, but this is dumb.

[GalaxyIdol]

Trump literally sounds like Senator Armstrong from MGR not even joking.

 

Makes America great again. Change the laws to suit the individual, not the other way around.

[vla1ne]

http://www.dailydot.com/layer8/trump-clinton-debate-online-polls-4chan-the-donald/

 

 

This better be bullshit. Because with screen shots I'm really annoyed reasing this. Not that online polls are reliable anyway, but this is dumb.

depends. it's interesting how the story claims polls not open to the public, on left wing websites, would have the left wing candidate winning by a landslide, but then when opened to the public, they take the L hard. i have no doubt that 4chan and reddit have done something, but everywhere i checked, the race was still dead heat, so odds are, it's only been done to the polls that were based upon mainstream rhetoric.

 

Trump literally sounds like Senator Armstrong from MGR not even joking.

 

Makes America great again. Change the laws to suit the individual, not the other way around.

nano-machines (made in china) will build the wall son.

[Phantom Roxas]

It's not evasion if it's legal. My parents got divorced for a bit becuase they could save more on taxes before I was born. Is that evasion? Or just clever money management.

 

If you want to see "pathetic" look at Bernie or Cruz supporting HRC or Trump respectively

Trump stupidly praised the mod, HRC didn't praise Matt Lauer ... I don't like beta Cuck Trump...would have voted for Rubio or Bernie if I wanted a coward

Prove that what Trump is doing is legal. If his response is "You don't like it, then change the law", then that shows that he thinks himself as above of the law, or that if the law must change, it must do so when it's convenient to him.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-directed-23-million-owed-to-him-to-his-charity-instead/2016/09/26/7a9e9fac-8352-11e6-ac72-a29979381495_story.html

 

"Tax-law experts say that more serious charges, such as income-tax evasion, are difficult to prove. One reason: in the world of tax law, ignorance is a defense."

 

Funny, wasn't intent the exact same issue as with Hillary and her emails? So he could get away with tax evasion by doing what she did.

 

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2016/09/26/donald-trump-on-not-paying-taxes-that-makes-me-smart/

 

"He is the first major-party candidate since 1976 to refuse to release his tax returns."

 

Wait, seriously? Trump is the first candidate in forty years to be this stubborn about his tax returns? What is Trump afraid of? He is a coward. You can't have it both ways. If it was legal, he wouldn't need to be so scared to do release his returns. If he wasn't doing something wrong, there wouldn't be anything to hide.

[Aerion Brightflame]

The other point is that even if what he is doing is legal, there has to be something in there that he doesn't want seen or else he'd have shown them too us just to brag about them. And it would have to be major, because otherwise he'd just lying about saying it was a bigger figure in the first place. Which means at least one of the things he has claimed that is relevant to tax returns is total bollocks - My bet is it's charitable donations and overall networth. 

[Phantom Roxas]

I could see it being net worth. Even if something he's hiding is somehow legal, it could still be embarrassing. He's very bad with handling money, so tax returns could indicate that he would not be able to benefit as many jobs as he would claim.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Yeah, OFC we did. It's called GOTV. But since you don't wanna mention it, page was on r/all so ETS and R/HRC def saw it too. We're actively churning out voters becuase we want to win. We've helped close to 10k Florida centipedes get Absentee ballot becuase we wanna win.

 

As for the polls, CNN sampled 15% more Dems and closed the poll in 15 minutes. Why aren't you protesting that?

 

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/politics-government/election/article104382951.html

 

She didn't gain jack sheet from yesterday

It's not our fault HRC has the enthusiasm of a limp dick

[Dad]

Shut the funk up about protests. You always play that passive aggressive bullshit when you're under fire. CNN is already under attack for being a Clinton bot,and the rest of us have attacked them for it already. And you still haven't answered my questions on those links from the previous page or two.

 

You day Clinton didn't gain sheet. Searches, news, and a bunch of Drumf bots I know disagree. It's not our fault the great orange couldn't calm down for ten minutes and jabroni about "Hilary interrupted me" to make a valid funking point. Not to mention the irony in that he interrupted literally twice as much, only to get baited like the childish moron he is.

 

"Let's praise tax evasion! The loops are there, so it's okay! "

 

"Look at that shill. How over prepared can you be? "

 

"What a bully. She rebutted at least 3 times!"

 

"I don't care what he says. Words don't mean anything."

 

See? See how easy it is to spout bullshit based off nitpicking what you liked and didn't like? You pick apart your opponent for hiding and stealing, when your favored candidate is just as toxic. Ironic and hypocritical.

 

I can't wait until this shitty election is over with, so I don't have to hear from Clinton cuck and Trump fucks anymore.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

What, I owned that sheet. R/T_D sticked a post with the links, but it got on R/all so every Reddit user including enough Trump Spam and R/HRC saw it.

 

Jesus next you're gonna tell me is wrong to go and get people to vote

 

We're not taking this election for Granted, every word out of HRC's mouth at this point is terrifying. Sorry for giving a sheet. I'm not gonna let my daughter grow up in a country where HRC is the standard for what young girls should aspire to

 

In other news, HRC's great anecdote was implicated in a murder scandal...for ever anti-Semite that jerks off to Trump on /pol/ HRC matches him through and through

 

CNN wasn't me attacking you, I'm just pointing out why we do what we do

[Dad]

As long as the right has been stiffing voters, it's about funking time they tried to get people out. That's the least you can funking do.

 

And you better hope Trump gets in office soon. Cuz his good pals over in Russia are ready to start sheet with Syria again. Not that Killary would be any better. Either way these two imbeciles have us on the brink of WW3.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

turns out Trump was telling the truth. We have him saying that Bush should leave Iraq up to the UN in 2003. Wonder if politifact will cover this

[Dad]

They should. Because they haven't covered anything other than Clinton and her shady ass recently.

 

And Trump needs to man the funk up and talk more about social justice. You know damn well that's what the people want. Don't be afraid of it. You can pull a bunch of funking votes from they alone.

 

Clinton needs to stop being a God damn dimwitted idiot and address the taxes and government more. She's evading like Wesley Snipes during tax season.

[Phantom Roxas]

They should. Because they haven't covered anything other than Clinton and her shady ass recently.

 

And Trump needs to man the funk up and talk more about social justice. You know damn well that's what the people want. Don't be afraid of it. You can pull a bunch of funking votes from they alone.

 

Clinton needs to stop being a God damn dimwitted idiot and address the taxes and government more. She's evading like Wesley Snipes during tax season.

 

Also evading like Trump.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Trump raised 18 Million off his donors today. Needless to say, a lot of us are terrified, and we're throwing everything we can at him

 

http://truepundit.com/media-bust-exact-script-of-lester-holts-plan-to-rig-presidential-debate-for-hillary-clinton-leaked-28-days-ago-to-true-pundit/

 

No surprise here, Cooper will be even worse *shrugs*

 

Don can't count on the Mods backing him, but that's no excuse for being a clown show

[Tentacruel]

It would be SO easy for Trump to pull in assloads of votes by talking about social justice stuff.  Any dickhead that would get mad at him for acknowledging the value of non white-guys for 5 seconds is still gonna vote for him over Hillary. 

 

It leads me to believe he may be actually stupid, rather than just a dick. 

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

They should. Because they haven't covered anything other than Clinton and her shady ass recently.

 

And Trump needs to man the funk up and talk more about social justice. You know damn well that's what the people want. Don't be afraid of it. You can pull a bunch of funking votes from they alone.

 

Clinton needs to stop being a God damn dimwitted idiot and address the taxes and government more. She's evading like Wesley Snipes during tax season.

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/298164-fox-news-claims-2003-clip-backs-up-trumps-iraq-war-opposition

 

They won't. 

 

What do mean social justice? Like apologizing for Birtherism? Sure, but not sure if he should back on stuff like Abortion