Yu-Gi-Oh! Rulings Questions

[guuu1234]

Thank you. I have to bother you with one more question though: What does "use" encompass? Summons, tributes, effects, attacks, Synchro or Xyz Material?

[evilfusion]

Thank you. I have to bother you with one more question though: What does "use" encompass? Summons, tributes, effects, attacks, Synchro or Xyz Material?

 

Unfortunately, this term is exceptionally vague and the TCG and OCG seem a bit divided on it.

 

The general standard is that "use" means every purpose that card can be used for, except costs. You cannot Summon, Set, attack with, Tribute, change Battle Position, use as Materials for Fusions, Synchros, Xyz, or activate effects.

 

I hope darkwolf clarifies.

[darkwolf777]

This just now happened to me, and I had no idea how the rulings go. If I declare "Harpie Lady" with Psi-Blocker, is my opponent allowed to still summon, set, or use monsters that treat themselves as "Harpie Lady" (like Harpie Queen, Harpie Channeler, etc.)

 

Harpie Queen and Harpie Channeler only have the name "Harpie Lady" while they are face-up on the field or in the Graveyard and is treated as a Continuous Effect. You can still Normal Summon them from the hand. This then creates a sort of infinite loop of conflicting Continuous Effects where "Harpie Queen/Harpie Channeler" will have her effect and be treated as "Harpie Lady" and then Psi-Blocker preventing you from using "Harpie Lady" thereby not allowing you to use Harpie Lady's effects, changing her name back to "Harpie Queen/Harpie Channeler", granting their effects back and getting their "Harpie Lady" effect back.

 

In the end, Harpie Queen/Harpie Channeler will have their effects be unusable by Psy-Blocker/Prohibition. Their names will be considered "Harpie Queen/Harpie Channeler" while they are on the field(and Graveyard with Psy-Blocker). Since they are no longer named "Harpie Lady", they can attack, change positions, be used for Synchros/Xyz/Fusion Materials, etc.

 

Cards like Harpie Lady 1/2/3 are always treated as Harpie Lady everywhere and not a Continuous Effect of any sort. They will continue to be considered a "Harpie Lady" at all times, regardless of negation.

 

Thank you. I have to bother you with one more question though: What does "use" encompass? Summons, tributes, effects, attacks, Synchro or Xyz Material?

 

"Cannot be use" generally means you cannot inherently Summon/Set the monster or perform the proper Fusion/Synchro/Xyz of named monster. You CAN use cards that would summon such a monster outside normal means, such as Instant Fusion summoning a Fusion Monster (as you are not using Fusion Material Monsters to properly Fusion Summon a monster). The card also cannot use any of their effects, whether they activate or are Continuous. A monster cannot Attack or change its Battle Position. A declared monster cannot be used as a Fusion/Synchro/Xyz Material Monster

 

A monster declared can still be Tributed, and a card declared can still be discarded from the hand for costs.

 

Only "Vicious Claw's" use of the words "cannot be used" cannot discard a "Vicious Claw" as a cost while under its own effect.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Actually, when an infinite loop occurs, doesn't the problem card get removed from the field or simply can't be played, via the ruling of Pole Position? Since the effect of Psi-Blocker works even when it's off the field, then wouldn't your opponent have to send their Channeler/Whatever to the grave?

[Zazubat]

Isn't "cannot be used" not just an other way to say "cannot be activated"? I mean, being used from the hand means being played face-up on the field right?

[evilfusion]

Cannot be used also means you can't discard it willingly or Set it (Vicious Claw).

[Zazubat]

Cannot be used also means you can't discard it willingly or Set it (Vicious Claw).

what do you mean by willingly, like with a card effect?

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

what do you mean by willingly, like with a card effect?

If you're forced to discard it by a card effect, then it's okay, but you can't purposely choose to discard it for a cost or card effect.

[Miror B]

Actually, when an infinite loop occurs, doesn't the problem card get removed from the field or simply can't be played, via the ruling of Pole Position?

It's either that or a stalemate is determined. As with Bad Reaction vs Prime Material Dragon, they plain and simple cancel each other out.

[darkwolf777]

Actually, when an infinite loop occurs, doesn't the problem card get removed from the field or simply can't be played, via the ruling of Pole Position? Since the effect of Psi-Blocker works even when it's off the field, then wouldn't your opponent have to send their Channeler/Whatever to the grave?

 

Destruction of a problem card is NOT the only way to stop such a loop.

 

For example, in infinite Morphing Jar #2 loops, Morphing Jar #2's flip effect will fail to activate if no further change can be reached with the cards remaining in the Main Deck

 

I believe a similar issue occurs here with Prohibition/Psi-Blocker dominance over Harpie Queen/Channeler although its a bit different.

 

Then again, these kinds of things are different in each situation =/

 

Cannot be used also means you can't discard it willingly or Set it (Vicious Claw).

 

The "cannot be discarded for costs" is unique to Vicious Claw. You can discard via Prohibition for costs. In both, there are no restrictions for discarding for the effect of a card.

[This Account is Unplayable]

I control a Phantom Beastcraft monster and a token.

 

I activate Dark Hole or Torrential Tribute.

 

I forgot how simultaneous destruction works, so does just the token die, or the monster too?

[Aix]

Only the token dies.

[Blake]

I control a Phantom Beastcraft monster and a token.

 

I activate Dark Hole or Torrential Tribute.

 

I forgot how simultaneous destruction works, so does just the token die, or the monster too?

Only the token will die, because they're protecting the monsters until they die, when the effect finishes resolving.

[Miror B]

I forgot how simultaneous destruction works, so does just the token die, or the monster too?

Look up Field Barrier vs Heavy Storm if you want more confirmation. Works the same way. Token dies, monster does not.

[This Account is Unplayable]

I actually just thought of that interaction just before I saw your post.

 

But yeah, thanks for the confirmation guys.

[werewolfjedi]

just want to double check on how a chain works in terms of timing before I post a concept thread, the best example being monster summoning.

player A summons, player b activates Torrential, player A activates a trap that stops it that is speed two, like the huge revolution is over, player B can NOT activate another card dependent on the summon to activate, such as another torrential or a bottomless or whatever, correct?

[Zazubat]

just want to double check on how a chain works in terms of timing before I post a concept thread, the best example being monster summoning.

player A summons, player b activates Torrential, player A activates a trap that stops it that is speed two, like the huge revolution is over, player B can NOT activate another card dependent on the summon to activate, such as another torrential or a bottomless or whatever, correct?

yup, you can only activate cards in response to the last chain as far as I know.

also, I want to know, can you use Stardust Radiance Dragon's effect in response to a card being activated?

[Aix]

No, you can do it as long as it is the same chain, though you cannot activate a Solemn after your Torrential Tribute. Also, Huge Revolution is Spell Speed 3.

 

For example: Player 1 Summons a monster, Player 2 activates Compulsory, Player 3 activates Trap Stun, Player 4 can activate Torrential Tribute.

[werewolfjedi]

No, you can do it as long as it is the same chain, though you cannot activate a Solemn after your Torrential Tribute. Also, Huge Revolution is Spell Speed 3.

 

For example: Player 1 Summons a monster, Player 2 activates Compulsory, Player 3 activates Trap Stun, Player 4 can activate Torrential Tribute.

 

oh really? well. I messed up then on my thoughts XP

[Zazubat]

No, you can do it as long as it is the same chain, though you cannot activate a Solemn after your Torrential Tribute. Also, Huge Revolution is Spell Speed 3.

 

For example: Player 1 Summons a monster, Player 2 activates Compulsory, Player 3 activates Trap Stun, Player 4 can activate Torrential Tribute.

I thought you could only activate cards in response to other cards, and not mix them up like that.

[Aix]

So did I, but I was proven wrong.

[Miror B]

I thought you could only activate cards in response to other cards, and not mix them up like that.

That's for negating other cards. Torrential and bottomless do not negate. So long as the chain is in response to the summon, cards like Bottomless and Torrential can still be used.

[Zazubat]

That's for negating other cards. Torrential and bottomless do not negate. So long as the chain is in response to the summon, cards like Bottomless and Torrential can still be used.

Ah that makes more sense, negating a card that happened before an other doens't make sense, it makes more sense right after, but since the others don't negate they can still be used. Something I got to keep in mind.

I got an other question, someone answered this on DN, but that'd DN, so I want a confirm here, if I have a face-down Black Falcon, and I control a Token, will it be destroyed by battle after it flips face-up? Also, would card effects work on it while face-down (this I'm pretty sure is gonna be a big fat NO, but want to be sure anyways). Oh, and I always forget, flipping face-up means by battle by a card effect and by yourself during your Main Phase right? With Ham-Strato, I'm not sure when it's effect will activate when it gets flipped.

[Miror B]

I got an other question, someone answered this on DN, but that'd DN, so I want a confirm here, if I have a face-down Black Falcon, and I control a Token, will it be destroyed by battle after it flips face-up? Also, would card effects work on it while face-down (this I'm pretty sure is gonna be a big fat NO, but want to be sure anyways). Oh, and I always forget, flipping face-up means by battle by a card effect and by yourself during your Main Phase right? With Ham-Strato, I'm not sure when it's effect will activate when it gets flipped.

Yes it will since it's flipped and doesn't exclude battle.

No because monsters do not have effects while face-down.

At the same time as all Flip Effects and Pseudo Flip Effects.

[Zazubat]

Yes it will since it's flipped and doesn't exclude battle.

No because monsters do not have effects while face-down.

At the same time as all Flip Effects and Pseudo Flip Effects.

I don't really get what you mean by doesn't exclude battle? What doesn't exclude battle? I also don't get what you mean by the last statement, at the same time? I never asked about timing, I asked if it would activate when it gets flipped by any of the things I mentioned.