Pokemon Sun & Moon

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

I think I remember the DPPt ROM taking a few minutes just to save data before the first gym (don't know if it was legitimately slow or again, my computer's drive being crap in running said DS emulator). Can only hope the remakes fix that (in whatever generation they'll end up being)

 

In terms of the generations I have played (which essentially amounts to 3/4 on emulators and 5/6 on an actual DS), suppose my ranking would be:

• 5 (even though W2 sometimes freezes up after a certain time)
• 6 (mostly due to lack of postgame stuff in X/Y, but I do appreciate the other changes. OR/AS was nice though [i don't care about the excess water])
• 4 (I probably didn't like the amount of roaming Pokes in here; that, and save time; likely the program I'm running it on)
• 3 (blame the glitches, especially given the single chance you have to catch the legendaries, and then that's it.)

To be honest, I probably think Unova/Kalos should be tied on my list. 

 

[spoiler=side stuff]

Latias gave me a lot of hell in the bottom two.

 

 

[Tinkerer]

I remember the save time being extremely long whenever you'd deposit/withdraw pokemon from the PC in gen 4 but I can't remember any other contributing factors besides that.

[♪ ♪Aria ♪ ♪]

My favorite is definitely gen 5, since it introduces the interesting triple battles, and most of the Pokemon designs are unique, such as Sigyliph, a hieroglyph, Cyogonal, and I also like Melloeta design.....monochromatic scheme

[Power Armour]

Generation 5 was easily the strongest in the series, an overarching plot, characters I gave a damn about, unique things that aren't even in gen 6 (Registering infinite items, pokemon stats and more) and other great things.

 

In terms of gens, I'd rate like this (Remakes notwithstanding)

2 - It's got the most balanced metagame in the series to date.

5 - Reasons already mentioned. Has a cheeky dig at some of the game mechanics.

3 - Memorable music and Pokemon

4 - Eh, was just kind of a drag, Platinum was easily the best of the three,

1 - I have memories of this, but some of the design choices seem ass backward when compared to other RPGS of the time.

6 - Cardboard characters, plot that tries to take itself seriously, terrible music, it's french, ryhorn sections and the environments, while detailed, are very 'eh'. 

 

In terms of remakes?

 

FRLG - Come on.

ORAS - 1:1 recreation and sooooooooooooooo much more.

HGSS - Takes forever to get going compared to its base game

 

I liked HGSS but jesus christ the johto half is just a drag.

[Aerion Brightflame]

I'd go like:

5 - Because one instalment had the best story in a main series pokemon game, and the other is my absolute favourite to replay because of the sheer variety of pokemon in the world. And short save times. 

3 - R/S were weak games, but Emerald is still my outright favourite pokemon game and I wish they had just made that instead of a direct port of R/S. Plus FR/LG were pretty good remakes.

4 - D/P were also fairly weak, and a struggle to replay since they feel slow, but the changes to battling (Physical and special split) are arguably the single biggest change in the games history. And my favourite remakes in the form of HS/SS. 

6 - QoL changes like Super training, and some of the fun gimmicks were nice, but the games have felt so safe/lifeless. X/Y are barely memorable (But forgiveable since there were a lot of semi-risky changes), and OR/AS were just poor poor remakes. 

2 - Great post story, but things aged terribly. As well as Jhoto feeling like a chore every time.

1 - It has nostalgia... but that's it really. Was good at the time, but stuff was so clunky due to us not knowing any better. 

 

And the long save times in D/P/Pt were just part of the series before gen 5, no idea why it just happened - It was a great QoL change. 

[~British Soul~]

For me it's

- 2

- 5

- 3

- 4

- 1

- 6

[Flame Dragon]

Wow, I am a SUPER outlier ranking Gen 5 so low. It makes sense though since as I said the way I judge the game is very different. It might also be because while I got SUPER into Gen 4, Gen 5 never clicked with me. I think part of that was the constant rain (stupid Politoed).

[toukotamago]

Hawaii seems like an interesting concept, but I've actually seen speculation that Sun and Moon will be set in Japan like the games used to be, with much more emphasis on the series' Japanese roots. Sun/Moon suggests that the mascot legendaries may be based on the Shinto sun and moon gods, Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi, and GameFreak may be doing this as a marketing move to try and win back fans from the clearly Japan-centric Yokai Watch fanbase, which is currently far and away more popular than Pokemon in Japan as of right now (which is a TRAVESTY but y'know w/e)

 

I'm actually surprised we still have so little information, considering these games are supposed to come out by the end of this year, but I suppose we'll just have to wait and see what happens. Personally I have high hopes for this game, as it seems like it's going to be much more ambitious than simply "the next core series of Pokemon"

[Tinkerer]

Hawaii seems like an interesting concept, but I've actually seen speculation that Sun and Moon will be set in Japan like the games used to be, with much more emphasis on the series' Japanese roots. Sun/Moon suggests that the mascot legendaries may be based on the Shinto sun and moon gods, Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi, and GameFreak may be doing this as a marketing move to try and win back fans from the clearly Japan-centric Yokai Watch fanbase, which is currently far and away more popular than Pokemon in Japan as of right now (which is a TRAVESTY but y'know w/e)

 

That... sounds basically like the vid Astro Dude had posted on page 6...

 

 

[spoiler=Said Vid]

 

Also there is this:

 

 

 

 

[toukotamago]

I actually thought I was on the latest page when I was actually on page 2 so I missed a LOT of discussion. When I saw the posts above my own I basically went "oops"

 

That's the one tho, yeah

[Power Armour]

I'd go like:

5 - Because one instalment had the best story in a main series pokemon game, and the other is my absolute favourite to replay because of the sheer variety of pokemon in the world. And short save times. 

3 - R/S were weak games, but Emerald is still my outright favourite pokemon game and I wish they had just made that instead of a direct port of R/S. Plus FR/LG were pretty good remakes.

4 - D/P were also fairly weak, and a struggle to replay since they feel slow, but the changes to battling (Physical and special split) are arguably the single biggest change in the games history. And my favourite remakes in the form of HS/SS. 

6 - QoL changes like Super training, and some of the fun gimmicks were nice, but the games have felt so safe/lifeless. X/Y are barely memorable (But forgiveable since there were a lot of semi-risky changes), and OR/AS were just poor poor remakes. 

2 - Great post story, but things aged terribly. As well as Jhoto feeling like a chore every time.

1 - It has nostalgia... but that's it really. Was good at the time, but stuff was so clunky due to us not knowing any better. 

 

And the long save times in D/P/Pt were just part of the series before gen 5, no idea why it just happened - It was a great QoL change. 

ORAS was weak? How? I'm still ploughing through postgame content at 134hrs and I still haven't caught all the legendaries or even filled the Hoenn Dex with 'Seen'.

 

It was brilliant:

-Unrestricted movement with Circle Pad (I hated the rollerskates)

-Running in grass again

-PokeCenters and Marts still split (eeexcelleeeent)

-Nearly every main legendary available between versions for those who cannot get Bank,

-DexNav

-Mirage Spots allow for dex filling,

-Blissey Bases allow for quick XP/HP EV's

-Battle Resort was built for breeding

-More Megas (for better or for worse)

-A decent story.

[Flame Dragon]

-DexNav

I can not overstate how amazing this thing was. Not only does it give you access to a TON of hidden abilities for Pokemon it also let you get an egg move on a Pokemon for your in game team if breeding wasn't something you wanted to do. Having Pain Split on my Dusclops was AWESOME.

[toukotamago]

While I love the Hoenn remakes dearly, I'm still salty over how they axed Emerald's Battle Frontier in favor of bringing the Battle Maison back, along with those eyesore waifus in charge of it

 

You also can't rematch gym leaders at all, which you could do in Emerald AND in the last remake?????? ok

 

I actually love all generations in varying degrees and it's hard for me to really pick favorites? Even Kalos which I overall detested at least had trainer customization which is a HUGE point, as well as some of the best character designs in the series along with BW. Overall I'd say my favorite game is HGSS—say what you will about Gen IV, but it had huge significance in the metagame category: the physical/special split was ESSENTIAL and that combined with significantly expanded movepools across the board made countless pokemon that were hard to work with before now practically usable. Plus, I had a lot of fun exploring Johto (tho I'm kinda biased since Crystal was my first game, ahaha). Emerald is second right after that, along with FRLG, then ORAS, Platinum, BW1, BW2… something along the lines of that order, sure

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

I just used DexNav to look for Absols holding Life Orb most of the time (or really anything holding items I want). That, or Eevees for egg moves that I can't breed with whatever 'mons I have now.

[Blake]

ORAS was funking terrible, outside of the final... Third? Mostly around the Aqua/Magma finale until Rayquaza, which is a ton of fun.

 

It was almost a 1:1 port with extra post game, just with improved graphics and P/S split, with the same terrible diversity and water routes weren't addressed at all, outside of Sharpedo + Repel, and just overall worse than a ROM Hack. Not to mention that Team Magma was clearly NOT the team the story was written around this time, and they fall so flat. And Magna was my favorite, before.

 

Improving mechanics does not make a good game if the actual gameplay is hampered. DexNav is a goodaddition, but it hardly saves a game with nearly no replay value, outside of Wonderlockes. Even then, replay value is one of the lowest in the series.

 

I have genuinely played hacks that address FAR more issues than ORAS did, and the only points I see in favor of it are availability, preferences (like skates, not understanding that you can run in the grass in XY with B, Pokecenter/Mart), or slight mechanic tweaks, outside of DexNav.

 

Also, Japan is not the only country with Sun and Moon deities, for funk's sake. And even if it IS Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi, legend arises =/= related to their region, given that Yin, Yang, and Wuji are in AMERICA.

[Power Armour]

ORAS was f***ing terrible, outside of the final... Third? Mostly around the Aqua/Magma finale until Rayquaza, which is a ton of fun.

 

It was almost a 1:1 port with extra post game, just with improved graphics and P/S split, with the same terrible diversity and water routes weren't addressed at all, outside of Sharpedo + Repel, and just overall worse than a ROM Hack. Not to mention that Team Magma was clearly NOT the team the story was written around this time, and they fall so flat. And Magna was my favorite, before.

 

Improving mechanics does not make a good game if the actual gameplay is hampered. DexNav is a goodaddition, but it hardly saves a game with nearly no replay value, outside of Wonderlockes. Even then, replay value is one of the lowest in the series.

 

I have genuinely played hacks that address FAR more issues than ORAS did, and the only points I see in favor of it are availability, preferences (like skates, not understanding that you can run in the grass in XY with B, Pokecenter/Mart), or slight mechanic tweaks, outside of DexNav.

 

Also, Japan is not the only country with Sun and Moon deities, for f***'s sake. And even if it IS Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi, legend arises =/= related to their region, given that Yin, Yang, and Wuji are in AMERICA.

Direct me to said Rom hacks and I might believe you there. I am open to try every single one.

Water routes really are not as bad as you say, and complaining about it 14 years after the fact is a bit sad, you expect them to change the map? Why? There'd be hell to pay for nintendo had they done that.

FRLG : 1:1 port with about an hour of postgame,

HGSS: 1:1 in 3D and some extra stuff that nobody used.

 

If you're complaining about a remake being a 1:1 port with improved graphics/gameplay, reevaluate your post, because ORAS is to RS as Zero Mission is to Metroid NES. And none of the four games I just listed are even terrible.

[Blake]

Direct me to said Rom hacks and I might believe you there. I am open to try every single one.

Water routes really are not as bad as you say, and complaining about it 14 years after the fact is a bit sad, you expect them to change the map? Why? There'd be hell to pay for nintendo had they done that.

FRLG : 1:1 port with about an hour of postgame,

HGSS: 1:1 in 3D and some extra stuff that nobody used.

 

If you're complaining about a remake being a 1:1 port with improved graphics/gameplay, reevaluate your post, because ORAS is to RS as Zero Mission is to Metroid NES. And none of the four games I just listed are even terrible.

Any of the "difficulty hacks". Greatly improved dicersity, harder gyms, and so forth. I forget what the Emerald one was called, but it made the game a much more enjoyable experience, even withou P/S split.

 

Water Routes wouldn't be an issue, but the fact remains that they could have done SOMETHING to make them more tolerable (change how encounters work slightly, such as "grass spots") other than just throwing in a single pokemon that functions as a bike. I'm not going to hold the design agaisnt them, but they fixed next to nothing.

 

FRLG is garbage, too.

 

HGSS is a lot better. It refined a game that was unrefined as hell, gave it new diversity in parts, and it was all around a better experience than the originals, and has a mix of GS and C that makes sense.

 

Meanwhile, ORAS is just plain worse than Emerald, and abandoned most of the good changes introduced there.

 

The only decent remake is HGSS, and that's before including the good mechanics put into it. ORAS and FRLG are jut bad, with the former being an honest waste of 40 dollars other than collecting sheet.

[toukotamago]

FRLG : 1:1 port with about an hour of postgame,

Sevii Islands wasn't quite as expansive as, say, exploring an entirely separate region, but I'd hardly say it could be wrapped up in an hour. Still kicks the crap out of XY's attempt at postgame. (although to be fair, comparing anything to XY is setting the bar rather low) Or even BW1's.

 

Point still stands tho, I see nothing listed that would constitute ORAS being "funking terrible". I understand the complaints with water routes to an extent—nobody likes treading on 100% random encounter territory, especially when there's usually all of two mons to encounter, but at the same time, repels are always an option if you feel it becomes an extreme annoyance, which personally it never, ever was for me.

 

(Pokemon should rid themselves of random encounters in caves/water in general, it isn't and literally never was a good game mechanic)

[Lonk]

I actually love water routes and hope that they are expanded upon further in Sun & Moon.

[toukotamago]

Again, just remove random encounters and I'll be all good on that front (hint: that'll never actually happen)

 

Don't understand what's so terrible about FRLG tho. Even if it is a 1:1 of RB, it's RB but actually playable. Unless you just straight-up hate Kanto in general

 

Again, I don't love it as much as HGSS, which was just lovely, but I still love it and am gonna stick behind it. Underwhelming as a remake in terms of content? Maybe, even if we consider it was the first one, but not a bad game by any stretch of the imagination

[Lonk]

Again, just remove random encounters and I'll be all good on that front (hint: that'll never actually happen)

 

Don't understand what's so terrible about FRLG tho. Even if it is a 1:1 of RB, it's RB but actually playable. Unless you just straight-up hate Kanto in general

 

Again, I don't love it as much as HGSS, which was just lovely, but I still love it and am gonna stick behind it. Underwhelming as a remake in terms of content? Maybe, even if we consider it was the first one, but not a bad game by any stretch of the imagination

 

I want the random encounter rates to stay though.

[toukotamago]

I… really don't see why you would, but hey. Honestly, if we would adopt a system akin to how XY handled that one badlands route and refined it, that would be ideal, in my opinion. It would reduce your ability to run around freely, as you would have to pay attention to where you're going if you didn't want to run into a pokemon at every step, but it also gives you the ability to actually have some control over whether you want to encounter a pokemon or not

 

(also, tfw you're much more into pkmn than ygo/the point of the whole forum you're on so this thread is probably essentially going to become your home base)

[Power Armour]

 

 

FRLG is garbage, too.

 

Explain.

When you stop and consider that FrLg was the only way to get all the Kanto/most of Johto's mons in 2004 and the fact this was an extreme point of contension for long time players, FRLG was excellent.

When you stop to consider it had excellent music, fantastic graphics (better than the gimped RSE sprites), great pace and animations that didnt take half an hour then yes, it is fantastic. I literally cannot think of anything overly bad or anything that makes it 'garbage'.

 

It took everything that RSE did right (running shoes ahem) and then some. If you seriously consider ~75% of this series garbage, I question your reason as to why you are even posting.

[Blake]

Explain.

When you stop and consider that FrLg was the only way to get all the Kanto/most of Johto's mons in 2004 and the fact this was an extreme point of contension for long time players, FRLG was excellent.

When you stop to consider it had excellent music, fantastic graphics (better than the gimped RSE sprites), great pace and animations that didnt take half an hour then yes, it is fantastic. I literally cannot think of anything overly bad or anything that makes it 'garbage'.

 

It took everything that RSE did right (running shoes ahem) and then some. If you seriously consider ~75% of this series garbage, I question your reason as to why you are even posting.

availability between regions isn't an argument. These games are not booster packs. Granting availability does not hurt or help a game, in and of itself.

 

"Great pace" wot

 

RBY isn't a greatly paced game. It's not terrible, but it's not great.

 

And again, you try to use mechanics to fix core issues like availability, difficulty, and pacing. He actual playability of the game.

 

Running Shoes are great, no one will argue otherwise, but the fact remains that RSE is, again, a port with "Oooh shiny!" Tacked on, just like ORAS. It doesn't seek to improve upon the original, only to remarket it. HGSS improved upon its areas and added new things, while also bringing Johto forward, not just one or the other.

 

Also itt 2 remakes are 75%, especially wen I said Emerald is better than ORAS, this not gen 3 hate.

[toukotamago]

I'm gonna have to disagree with you on the point that RBY isn't terrible. I couldn't stand it—it's a sloppy, poorly functioned mess. While I wouldn't say FRLG fixed as a lot of its problems so much as it was a natural progression starting with Gen II which made the remake actually playable, the point stands that it far outclasses the original game, glorified port or otherwise. Whether that actually makes it good or not is up for debate, but I still firmly believe the game is fantastic.