Literary Merit and Quality of Writing

[Aix]

What are your thoughts on writing and storytelling having "quality"? What's your definition of quality and what's its place in the book, gaming, and entertainment industries? Opinions on supposedly inferior works, for example Twilight, and their popularity?

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

You would think I, who call myself a writer, would have a lot to say on the subject?
Not exactly.

To me a quality is dependent on the person. And to me, quality is simply something that is engaging, interesting, and gives me emotional responses in some way. Something I want to read all the way through.

[Thar]

I value writing as if it were someone who's experienced said story describing it as if they experienced it first-hand and know every detail.

[Agro]

Quality depends on what you want out of the work.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

beautify is the in the eye of the beholder.

 

Did I enjoy twilight? No. Did someone enjoy it? Yes.

 

Just cause I (term used generically) didn't enjoy or see merits in something doesn't mean it doesn't have merits.

 

Personally found the concept of certain vampires feast on humans and others on animals, and the subsequent portrayal of those two quite interesting 

 

"merit" is a very subjective term that is quite hard to quantify, thus objectify 

[Aerion Brightflame]

Judging a story on it's merits is harder than judging a piece on it's merits as literature. Because what a story means to someone varies significantly more than the actual quality of the writing.  

 

I personally feel there is a difference between something being enjoyable, and something be good in terms of critical analysis. Critical analysis being the closest to objective analysis we can get. Even then, it will obviously vary depending on whose looking at it. 

 

As for popularity, it's a harder thing to explain. Quality and popularity don't always go hand in hand, in fact sometimes they can be polar opposites. Which is kinda sad. 

 

It's an interesting discussion. 

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Quality and popularity don't always go hand in hand, in fact sometimes they can be polar opposites. Which is kinda sad. 

 

It's an interesting discussion. 

Would this be something like 50 Shades of Grey or maybe even Jurassic World?

 

I'd argue the concept of "merit" is one of fluidity itself

[Blake]

There is such a thing as poor writing. As such, there is

 

For example, iirc, the word choices and grammar in Harry Potter make it look like the series was written by a middle schooler. Then there are stories written with more poor plots, characterization, dialogue, and so on.

 

A good core story can be ruined by poor use of language. A poor story can sometimes be saved by witty writing. And the opposite of these can be true, depending on how well the strong half is implemented.

 

There is no black and white, but there is definitely a degree of good/bad, hard to measure perfectly though it is, and you can enjoy something that is bad, like The Room or The Happening. Liking something does not mean it was well made, presented, or (in some cases) performed, and this is something people seem to not understand in this type of discussion, both for and against.

[Sethera]

One might say good grammar and spelling is integral to quality, but I disagree. I remember once I wrote a character having an accent and in the peer review was criticized for poor spelling in his dialogue. However, I'd say that in that case, the poor spelling didn't matter so much.

I would say, however, that quality is different from whether somebody enjoys something. I wouldn't call Twilight high-quality, but it can still be considered entertaining to people. And of course, we all have differing tastes as well. Still, I would say most people would agree books like Oliver Twist or Lolita are high-quality, though we wouldn't all find them entertaining.

[Aix]

As for popularity, it's a harder thing to explain. Quality and popularity don't always go hand in hand, in fact sometimes they can be polar opposites. Which is kinda sad.

Are you of the opinion that some things shouldn't be as popular as they are then?

 

Still, I would say most people would agree books like Oliver Twist or Lolita are high-quality, though we wouldn't all find them entertaining.

Could it be a case where everyone else finds them high-quality, or everyone else praises them so we become biased in our judgement? I really do find it interesting that I could potentially have a vastly different verdict on something depending on my prior impressions of the work.

 

 

I agree with what Black said in that there is a degree of good and bad, but can't be quantified since it is not purely objective. However, while quality is subjective, as humans we tend to feel the same way about certain things, and to discount it entirely does not sit with me. Good writing in storytelling mediums implies a variety of things such as techniques used to make a plot gripping, well-developed characterization, avoiding contrivances, using good diction and atmosphere, etc. and lacking these things that would make a story good in people's eyes generally makes it bad.

 

I also exclude blatant fanservice in qualities that make something good writing for the two reasons that people will disagree greatly on the use of fanservice and that fanservice tends to detract from the other qualities, making it a big minus for people who aren't into it. Of course, what classifies as fanservice and what doesn't is a grey area, but we can generally agree certain things like Fifty Shades of Grey aren't in the grey :)

[Sethera]

I like what I like, and I don't give a damn what others think about what I like, so at least in my case, there is no outside influence.

However, I am also mature enough to realize that a certain book might be high-quality even if it doesn't appeal to me. For instance, most of my schoolmates hated Great Expectations, but they all agreed that it was still good writing. Of course, quality isn't completely objective, but it's not completely subjective either.

[Aerion Brightflame]

Are you of the opinion that some things shouldn't be as popular as they are then?

 

Did you miss my big GoT rant earlier this year? 

 

I'm a person who is drawn to artistic merit more so than raw entertainment value I would say. It's not shocking that I find things I personally think to be of poor quality to be overblown in terms of popularity.