House passes bill that could limit Syrian refugees

[Simping For Hina]

It's always good to remember just why I dislike you so much, Winter. You really don't know what you're talking about.

I'll focus on the least annoying part for now.

 

Russia should take in refugees. Everyone should. Because it's not a matter of who is to blame and who should do it based on that. Makes it sound like a punishment instead of just doing what's right because we're all human.

It isn't that we should. It is about how we're going to support them and the conflicts that will transpire. Muslims even now are getting attacked, kicked out of their jobs, etc, simply because of their race. And the money that would put more straight on budgets. Along with trying to get jobs and educate them, etc. We can't just take them in if we don't know how we are going to take them in. Even if they would have a better life than running for their lives, it would still be a life of discontent and inhumanity until we have a clear method to do so.

 

Also, guys shut the hell up about attacking each other. It is pathetic from every end, and none of you are actually great if you're letting emotions irrationality consume your opinions. This topic isn't about emotions, but about logic and the way to argue it is with logic and unbias.

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

As if you do! Look how selectively you disperse your contempt amidst the airs of free-hugs-for-all! You're an ambassador for cowards everywhere.

 

Winter, I like you too. You speak your mind and fearful prigs hate you for it. It's the way it's always been, happened to Socrates and Jesus. 

I believe people should be as good as they can be to people, but I'm human like everyone else. I don't hate him for speaking his mind, I don't even hate him. I just don't particularly like him. For many reasons some of which are unrelated to this particular discussion.

Also, shouldn't you like me too by that logic? When I said I didn't like Winter, wasn't I "speaking my mind"? or do you only like those who speak their minds and people get upset at them for it?

Oh. That happened too.

Aww, you do care ^^

 

 

It isn't that we should. It is about how we're going to support them and the conflicts that will transpire. Muslims even now are getting attacked, kicked out of their jobs, etc, simply because of their race. And the money that would put more straight on budgets. Along with trying to get jobs and educate them, etc. We can't just take them in if we don't know how we are going to take them in. Even if they would have a better life than running for their lives, it would still be a life of discontent and inhumanity until we have a clear method to do so.

 

Also, guys shut the hell up about attacking each other. It is pathetic from every end, and none of you are actually great if you're letting emotions irrationality consume your opinions. This topic isn't about emotions, but about logic and the way to argue it is with logic and unbias.

Yeah I know but I guess it's umm....Basically I think that ideally all countries that can should try and help out a little. Sorry I wasn't clear on the "that can" part, whoops.

 

And yeah I tried to avoid attacking and it happened a couple times still, working on that. though my dislike of some people aside, I still believe that even with logic it's possible to work out something so we all can help them out.

[Simping For Hina]

Yeah I know but I guess it's umm....Basically I think that ideally all countries that can should try and help out a little. Sorry I wasn't clear on the "that can" part, whoops.

 

What countries can help? No countries can help, properly. They can take them in, but that isn't helping and it wouldn't be enough to help. In essence, it wouldn't be even helpful so mostly the fact that countries "can't" help even if they can do something so small.

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

What countries can help? No countries can help, properly. They can take them in, but that isn't helping and it wouldn't be enough to help. In essence, it wouldn't be even helpful so mostly the fact that countries "can't" help even if they can do something so small.

I'm tired and when I first read that I saw "Help help help help" Anyway.

 

that's a really good point. Honestly it's...honestly it's partially hope not gonna lie. As in, there has to be SOMEthing we can do we're not doing/seeing just yet. Like I can't believe that there's absolutely no help that can be had. And so when I say everyone that can help, should, in some way. I mean that, that there's certainly something that can be done to help.

 

Sorry if I'm not being clear/wording badly.

[Simping For Hina]

I'm tired and when I first read that I saw "Help help help help" Anyway.

 

that's a really good point. Honestly it's...honestly it's partially hope not gonna lie. As in, there has to be SOMEthing we can do we're not doing/seeing just yet. Like I can't believe that there's absolutely no help that can be had. And so when I say everyone that can help, should, in some way. I mean that, that there's certainly something that can be done to help.

 

Sorry if I'm not being clear/wording badly.

There are things that can be done, but it isn't enough to do that will save them. Only give refugees moments of life until they are hit by societal problems that will push them from being humans to being compared to trash. There is always something to be done, but that something isn't always what needs to be done to better the world. This is what I was talking about; being biased. Hope is a great feat, but is nothing if you don't know the actual problems at hand and that is was is conflicting about everything people have said. Their opinions are getting in the way from formulating proper analysis on what is at hand, and their opinions are faltered because they don't know what is at hand except the bare minimum. Which is also where opinions are put together.

 

Taking in refugees is not easy at all, especially when society pushed them away and there is no clear method to support them in society. So, the plans are needing time to put together and until then, we will have to wait and give it time anyways.

[Guardsman Sly Marbo]

The problem isn't that we don't want to take in refugees, it's that we can't. England doesn't have the money, space, infrastructure or the leader to handle it. Unfortunately, I'm wondering, seriously wondering how they get from where they are to where they end up, and not getting deported or turned away, I mean, hell, they'd need to get to a country that would allow them to fly, yes? Either way you're going across multiple countries/continents and that's if you make it past border controls/immigration/security, which means the volume of refugees getting out would be lower, yes?

 

Or maybe ISIS don't have as hard a grip on middle-eastern populace as we thought?

[Flame Dragon]

The problem isn't that we don't want to take in refugees, it's that we can't. England doesn't have the money, space, infrastructure or the leader to handle it. Unfortunately, I'm wondering, seriously wondering how they get from where they are to where they end up, and not getting deported or turned away, I mean, hell, they'd need to get to a country that would allow them to fly, yes? Either way you're going across multiple countries/continents and that's if you make it past border controls/immigration/security, which means the volume of refugees getting out would be lower, yes?

 

Or maybe ISIS don't have as hard a grip on middle-eastern populace as we thought?

We totally have the space. The US allots X number of refugees to come in each year. They get here by taking out a zero interest loan which they then need to pay back. While they wait for it they go through a HEAVY screening process that take multiple years.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

It isn't that we should. It is about how we're going to support them and the conflicts that will transpire. Muslims even now are getting attacked, kicked out of their jobs, etc, simply because of their race. And the money that would put more straight on budgets. Along with trying to get jobs and educate them, etc. We can't just take them in if we don't know how we are going to take them in. Even if they would have a better life than running for their lives, it would still be a life of discontent and inhumanity until we have a clear method to do so.

 

Also, guys shut the hell up about attacking each other. It is pathetic from every end, and none of you are actually great if you're letting emotions irrationality consume your opinions. This topic isn't about emotions, but about logic and the way to argue it is with logic and unbias.

I have no emotion here.

 

ISIS uses those children and widows as a food source. We're being irrational by irrationally not cutting it off. 

 

I'm definitely not great, never said I was. I just dislike people when they are unable to accept responsibility and wear their emotion on their sleeves.

 

We are the reason ISIS exists because we put Saddam down. That is on us, and it's high time we take responsibility.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

I believe people should be as good as they can be to people, but I'm human like everyone else. I don't hate him for speaking his mind, I don't even hate him. I just don't particularly like him. For many reasons some of which are unrelated to this particular discussion.

Also, shouldn't you like me too by that logic? When I said I didn't like Winter, wasn't I "speaking my mind"? or do you only like those who speak their minds and people get upset at them for it?

Oh. That happened too.

Aww, you do care ^^

 

I'm not for upsetting people for the sake of it, nor do I dislike you. If, however, you think I'm going to commend you for taking shots at someone who's already practically persona non grata here (because they speak their mind), you're mistaken. It is because I took a liking to you since you were new here, since your posts were in the double-digits and your avatar was an actual cow (albeit a cartoony plush one), that I find it so frustrating when you play to the masses as opposed to speaking your mind. I don't think you're speaking your mind at all, I think you're posturing for others. That's not something I've ever seen from Winter, and it's only in hindsight that I now notice that Winter didn't stoop to your level by retaliating when you took your shot, I ended up doing it instead. This isn't the first time I've seen you attack Winter ad hominem either, has Winter *ever* done that to you? *What* is your problem, CowCow? 

 

If you honestly and uncategorically dislike Winter, you're not trying hard enough for someone I thought was supposed to be all about accepting others. 

 

 

 

Also, guys shut the hell up about attacking each other. It is pathetic from every end, and none of you are actually great if you're letting emotions irrationality consume your opinions. This topic isn't about emotions, but about logic and the way to argue it is with logic and unbias.

 

 

Without emotions, there would be no problems for logic to solve. Without emotions, there is no logic. Without emotions, we might as well be dead.

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

I'm not for upsetting people for the sake of it, nor do I dislike you. If, however, you think I'm going to commend you for taking shots at someone who's already practically persona non grata here (because they speak their mind), you're mistaken. It is because I took a liking to you since you were new here, since your posts were in the double-digits and your avatar was an actual cow (albeit a cartoony plush one), that I find it so frustrating when you play to the masses as opposed to speaking your mind. I don't think you're speaking your mind at all by , I think you're posturing for others. That's not something I've ever seen from Winter, and it's only in hindsight that I now notice that Winter didn't stoop to your level by retaliating when you took your shot, I ended up doing it instead. This isn't the first time I've seen you attack Winter ad hominem either, has Winter *ever* done that to you? *What* is your problem, CowCow? 

 

If you honestly and uncategorically dislike Winter, you're not trying hard enough for someone I thought was supposed to be all about accepting others. 

I was joking with that part. And I don't play to the masses. If you think I don't speak my mind you don't know me at all. I am always as honest as I possibly can be, even when it is to my detriment. I only take back words when I truly believe differently and have gone too far. I won't ever hold back on my complete opinion. Just because my opinions tend to be not on a certain side of things doesn't mean I don't give them.

 

He actually did retaliate, only passive aggressively and in a status. Just mentioning that.

Winter knows what the problems I have with him are, I've expressed it to him multiple times. Though he seems to change up how to interpret it a few times so I'm not sure what he currently thinks. I don't need to explain it to you. Trust me, I have my reasons, and he probably has his.

 

You don't know how many chances I've given him. When he first came back I admitted to him i was leery, but then I started to like him, and then he threw that in my face. I don't want to get into that off-subject thing here though. But since you seem to be under the impression that it's random...

[epicmemesbro]

No country will consent to accepting refugees without a sense of security. This probably means institutionalizing them or allowing then to live on isolated lands. It does sound like segregation, but I feel like this is one of the few ways the refugees can at least get to a safe spot for the time being.

 

 

On a side note, I feel both sides are in the wrong. Sure, you people were contributing legitimately to the discussion however it took a turn for the worst and it resulted in both sides using this topic to straw man and toss ad hominems at each other.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

I don't need to explain it to you. Trust me, I have my reasons 

 

If this is your idea of speaking your mind and being "always as honest as possible" I think we're done here. 

 

Sorry for the commotion everyone. Let's go refugees, boo to Islamophobia, boo to terrorism and the people funding it, etc. 

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

If this is your idea of speaking your mind and being "always as honest as possible" I think we're done here. 

 

Sorry for the commotion everyone. Let's go refugees, boo to Islamophobia, boo to terrorism and the people funding it, etc. 

Really? I'm so sorry I won't explain a matter that's literally just between me and Winter, you don't have any reason to needing to know. I've given some of the information just not all. What, you expect me to, in this thread, explain my every interaction with him that led to my conclusion? That's a bit immature to expect that from someone, and being "honest as possible" I think your attempts to make me out to be a liar, or w/e this is, are pathetic.

 

And yes to the second part.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

It's not between you and Winter because you're taking shots in public. I still haven't the slightest clue why you'd do that and would rather you stopped than explained yourself. The only reason I'd even have you explain yourself would be in an attempt to convince you otherwise as I feel there's a lot to like about Winter, but you haven't even given me that to work with ("I've given him chances" and "I have my reasons" don't tell me what Winter did to you or what your problem is).

 

If you persist in your personal attacks then I have no problem retaliating in kind, but would honestly rather we got along because this type of thing:

 

 

It's always good to remember just why I dislike you so much, Winter. You really don't know what you're talking about.

I'll focus on the least annoying part for now.

 

makes me uncomfortable af, especially from someone voted the most popular member here. 

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

It's not between you and Winter because you're taking shots in public. I still haven't the slightest clue why you'd do that and would rather you stopped than explained yourself. The only reason I'd even have you explain yourself would be in an attempt to convince you otherwise as I feel there's a lot to like about Winter, but you haven't even given me that to work with ("I've given him chances" and "I have my reasons" don't tell me what Winter did to you or what your problem is).

 

If you persist in your personal attacks then I have no problem retaliating in kind, but would honestly rather we got along because this type of thing:

 

 

 

makes me uncomfortable af, especially from someone voted the most popular member here. 

I can PM you but I don't think I should talk about it all here. tbh the shot was more of a "I'm so tired of this crap" kinda thing. I do think I went a bit too far but I also think your defense was a bit much too (comparing to jesus).

Though I will say I had stopped, that was the only truly personal attack I did to my knowledge.

 

But anyway not gonna reply in the thread anymore for obvious reasons. If ya wanna talk it out send me a PM and we can talk it out.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Well cowcow's and my problem aside. 

 

Daesh has it's programs to raise "cubs" already, where they take children and corrupt them at an early age. I don't care if you like Muslims or not. The fact remains that by accepting refugees you're putting a knife in Daesh, and that is EVERY human's moral duty

 

I think it's a bit rich of us to say, "Make Russia take them" when we lack the civic mentality to do it yourself.

 

If the US is that afraid of widows and children (yes both of those have been used as Suicide Bombers IK) we have many islands with little to mo population. Segregation aside, anything is better than having Daesh swine ruling you

 

Doing NOTHING or making it so slow that it's basically nothing, is what's not acceptable 

[LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow]

Basically. Everyone should do what they can. (Yes I know Dae, I get what you mean) That's pretty much what I've thought through the whole thing.

Of course it's not so easy, but doesn't mean it shouldn't be done.

[Elijah~]

Not attempting to sound ignorant, just stating my opinion. Our previous security check process was not really that secure from the start. So I think the House made a smart decision. Not saying that all Islams are terrorists.

[Resident Fascist]

 

Daesh has it's programs to raise "cubs" already, where they take children and corrupt them at an early age. I don't care if you like Muslims or not. The fact remains that by accepting refugees you're putting a knife in Daesh, and that is EVERY human's moral duty

 

Where exactly are they getting these children from? I highly doubt they are from the wives of the fighters. Gonna assume at least one of them's got knocked up while they're there. While they are certainly a problem, the fact that the eyes of big nations are now focused squarely upon them, such as Russia and China, likely means a combined force could far far outnumber them. I'm personally of the belief if the world is to get anywhere, total military action to inflict

a crushing blow to the power structure would break the back of the organization. If they are commited to all out war, then responding in such a way seems acceptable. The thing with terror organizations is they know they would be crushed in a war between a nation, even the smallest nation could field probably 5 or 10 times the military might of them. That is why terror organizations do what they do, attack civilians and generally strike fear into the world.

 

If any big nation where to absolutely drop the hammer and head to all out conflict, not just aerial strikes and jet bombardment, they would quickly collapse. This isn't just about refugees. But of course, the lives of soldiers and maybe even their fighters if they are willing to surrender in peace, highly doubtful but maybe some could yet be saved must be considered. It would also have to be done so fast that the leadership would not have time to flee, or surround the entire "state", just taking back their cities one by one will do nothing if the leadership hides and begins another organization several years down the line.

 

Of course, the world would have to do things like A) cut the supply lines. They can threaten violence all they like but it's a proven fact you can't shoot anyone without any ammunition. B ) Freeze foriegn donations to the organization. C) Shut down the online propaganda machine. And D) Do all of this practically instantly. How many terror organizations has the world collectively collapsed and they've just been rebuilt? The problem is that this one is different, it has money. It's taking land and it's having a lot of success.

 

Its not just refugees, in this case.