Tentacruel Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 So apparently, the gunman allegedy was targeting Christians. http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/02/us/oregon-umpqua-community-college-shooting/index.html Even if this is true, no one is going to admit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fusion X. Denver Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 I sincerely hope that America does something to try and remedy this soon. Stricter gun laws, bettering mental healthcare, both, just do something already. Failing to agree or compromise on the issue of these mass murders is the biggest problem to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant Monster RAEG-HAPYP Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 I should mention that gun violence and mass shootings are not something that popped up in the last few years. It's been a problem for a long time. Heck, I've read that the murder rate in the U.S. was even higher back then than it was now. This country has a history of school shootings, as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENMaker Posted October 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 Read something earlier which I doubt I'll find now, but basically one description of this used was "the worst mass shooting incident in the US since June". 4 months ago. Surely the fact that this statement even exists is more than enough evidence a problem exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebuchet MS Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 You know, one of the arguments for more guns is that "if more of the public have guns, they'd be able to check a shooting spree better." But what if there isn't a shooting spree? Have they envisioned what it's like to go about a society where everyone and their mother - literally - has a gun on them? I won't feel safe. I'd feel even more paranoid. I already take extra care with the things I say to avoid accidentally offending someone, because nearly anything you talk about can be a minefield these days. Accidentally offending someone is a pretty scary experience - they'd be all mad and you'd think "where did I go wrong?" I'm sure we've all been there in at least one point in our lives. Now replay that scenario, but everyone's got a gun. Instead of worrying about a black eye at worst or something, now you have to be careful not to get shot in the spur of the moment because someone got momentarily angry. And this can happen with very little warning, before your buddies around you can react and draw their guns to try defuse the situation without any shots being fired. Let's also not forget how unsafe it would feel if you had to have a weapon on you at most times to even feel remotely safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant Monster RAEG-HAPYP Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 You know, one of the arguments for more guns is that "if more of the public have guns, they'd be able to check a shooting spree better." But what if there isn't a shooting spree? Have they envisioned what it's like to go about a society where everyone and their mother - literally - has a gun on them? I won't feel safe. I'd feel even more paranoid. I already take extra care with the things I say to avoid accidentally offending someone, because nearly anything you talk about can be a minefield these days. Accidentally offending someone is a pretty scary experience - they'd be all mad and you'd think "where did I go wrong?" I'm sure we've all been there in at least one point in our lives. Now replay that scenario, but everyone's got a gun. Instead of worrying about a black eye at worst or something, now you have to be careful not to get shot in the spur of the moment because someone got momentarily angry. And this can happen with very little warning, before your buddies around you can react and draw their guns to try defuse the situation without any shots being fired. Let's also not forget how unsafe it would feel if you had to have a weapon on you at most times to even feel remotely safe.Yeah, it wouldn't make things safer, but it's not like any of those gun nuts care about that. I do not hate guns, mind you, but I do hate the NRA/gun lobby and the gun rights movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 You know, one of the arguments for more guns is that "if more of the public have guns, they'd be able to check a shooting spree better." I hate this argument and I think its the stupidest thing ever. I've written this else where so I'm just going to copy paste that since I'm not sure if I posted it here. The argument that if "a good guy with a gun was around during a mass shooting they would have made a difference" is such a bad one. Not only does that person need to deal with the mental strain of having gone from a peaceful situation to one where they are under attack they also need to deal with the chaos that is now unfolding all around them. All while trying to quickly draw their gun and actually hit the gunmen. Could it happened, sure. But the degree of certainly this is said time and time again confounds me since they seem to ignore all that crap that will be happening during one of these situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant Monster RAEG-HAPYP Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I hate this argument and I think its the stupidest thing ever. I've written this else where so I'm just going to copy paste that since I'm not sure if I posted it here. The argument that if "a good guy with a gun was around during a mass shooting they would have made a difference" is such a bad one. Not only does that person need to deal with the mental strain of having gone from a peaceful situation to one where they are under attack they also need to deal with the chaos that is now unfolding all around them. All while trying to quickly draw their gun and actually hit the gunmen. Could it happened, sure. But the degree of certainly this is said time and time again confounds me since they seem to ignore all that crap that will be happening during one of these situations.And also, if the said suspect has something like an AK and the "good guy" only has a handgun, I don't favor those odds. Also, related http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/02/politics/jeb-bush-donald-trump-stuff-happens/index.html EDIT: Apparently, the sheriff in that county is very much against gun control, despite what happened here. He even said that he would not comply to enforce with any gun control laws or something like that. http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/02/us/oregon-shooting-sheriff-john-hanlin/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant Monster RAEG-HAPYP Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 It seriously boggles my mind that even with NRA's stupid ammount of power, there hasnt been a unified outcry against these incidents. When will the waste of human life be enough for the american people as a whole to understand that the masses cannot be trusted with this type of acess to guns. Is the greater mass that brainwashed by the gun lobby to the point they seriously consider ALL of this a necessary evil for some make believe scheme that having lots of guns floating around somehow makes things safer? (Eventhough statistic is rock solid that it's the exact opposite. Areas with few guns have significantly less crime then those with lots of guns) Seriously, the rate at which these seem to be occuring is horrifying to say the least, and that it's hitting the point where people are even being desensitied to it chills me to my core. This is a tragic, incredibly unnecessary loss of life, and should be recognised as such. My thoughts and condolences goes out to the friends and families of the victims, and I seriously wish they hadnt killed the shooter if only because I know someone, somewhere, will consider this guy a martyr, even if ultimately it just seems as a suicide by cop, judging by the article not seeming to hint at the shooter having had some kind of motive. So, I've been thinking about this recently. About the lack of an outcry. I wonder if fear of backlash from the gun nuts has anything to do with it. I feel most gun owners are genuiely good people who might even be tired of this issue themselves, but then, you got the gun thugs. But then again, it would be hard to go after hundreds or thousands of people, so I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epicmemesbro Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 I've noticed that no one really mentioned this, or beated around the bush for that matter. But considering the circumstances this may as well be called a hate crime. He was targeting Christians. I'm also surprised that no official has stated this, maybe I shouldn't be.... also @ Raeg. Aks are outlawed federally. Idk what you actually meant by that statement though.... Back to the religion motive. This might be ignored by the media and officials due to a double standard being put in place. When I mean ignored I mean like ignored as an issue, I'm not saying they outright ignored it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant Monster RAEG-HAPYP Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 I've noticed that no one really mentioned this, or beated around the bush for that matter. But considering the circumstances this may as well be called a hate crime. He was targeting Christians. I'm also surprised that no official has stated this, maybe I shouldn't be.... also @ Raeg. Aks are outlawed federally. Idk what you actually meant by that statement though.... Back to the religion motive. This might be ignored by the media and officials due to a double standard being put in place. When I mean ignored I mean like ignored as an issue, I'm not saying they outright ignored it.... I don't know about that. I remember reading you can't import them from Russia anyore, but I don't think the gun itself is illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halubaris Maphotika Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 I've noticed that no one really mentioned this, or beated around the bush for that matter. But considering the circumstances this may as well be called a hate crime. He was targeting Christians. I'm also surprised that no official has stated this, maybe I shouldn't be.... also @ Raeg. Aks are outlawed federally. Idk what you actually meant by that statement though.... Back to the religion motive. This might be ignored by the media and officials due to a double standard being put in place. When I mean ignored I mean like ignored as an issue, I'm not saying they outright ignored it....Fox News has repeatedly mentioned this fact Ad Nauseum. Not just them, but numerous Republican Officials, and Presidential Candidates have stated this as well. I find this extremely interesting. While I agree with almost everything Oliver says, I disagree with his attempts to take Mental Illness away from the Gun Control issue. We need Gun Control Laws to keep the Mentally Ill from getting guns, but I agree that many only bring up the Mentally Ill when tragedy strikes. This is coming from someone who suffers from seeing and hearing things, but I don't feel that makes my argument better or worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant Monster RAEG-HAPYP Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 Fox News has repeatedly mentioned this fact Ad Nauseum. Not just them, but numerous Republican Officials, and Presidential Candidates have stated this as well. I find this extremely interesting. While I agree with almost everything Oliver says, I disagree with his attempts to take Mental Illness away from the Gun Control issue. We need Gun Control Laws to keep the Mentally Ill from getting guns, but I agree that many only bring up the Mentally Ill when tragedy strikes. This is coming from someone who suffers from seeing and hearing things, but I don't feel that makes my argument better or worse. Mental health is definitely one of the issues aside from easy access to guns that needs to be addressed. However, I agree that it shouldn't detract from the gun control issue. On a side note, I came across this not too long ago: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/police-refusing-shooters-fear-copycats-34222205 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted October 6, 2015 Report Share Posted October 6, 2015 Mental health is definitely one of the issues aside from easy access to guns that needs to be addressed. However, I agree that it shouldn't detract from the gun control issue. On a side note, I came across this not too long ago: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/police-refusing-shooters-fear-copycats-34222205 I feel like a good compromise for this would be to give the name to the people you would benefit from it and without it from the public. We don't need the persons name to know their history and motivation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted October 8, 2015 Report Share Posted October 8, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XM7jxfxjphk [citation needed] [citation needed] [citation needed] [bad comparison] [strawman argument] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENMaker Posted October 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2015 In any other country Trump would be finished. Suppose in any other country he'd not have been taken seriously at any point but still. Also I absolutely hate Fox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 ^Wouldn't be so sure bout that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant Monster RAEG-HAPYP Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 So, in regards to the gun control discussion...this came up: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-obama-considers-executive-action-gun-background-checks/story?id=34366289 What do you think? For me, even if he does go through with it, if our next President is a Republican, it will likely be undone. So, I dunno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shalltear Bloodfallen Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 I'm not familiar with what it exactly means when the White House makes an executive action on something, but if it works in the way I think I'm extremely critical that it's even gonna take effect even while Obama is still president, and if it does go through a republican president is practicly given to dissolve it ASAP. The GOP made it their mission to block Obama every single step of the way. Now that they control both Congress and the Senate, I dont expect for a second that they plan to let this slide as long as they have any say whatsoever in the matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 It is ludicrous that you can get around background checks when buying a gun at a gun show that a common sense executive action like that would be a good place to start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerion Brightflame Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 So, in regards to the gun control discussion...this came up: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-obama-considers-executive-action-gun-background-checks/story?id=34366289 What do you think? For me, even if he does go through with it, if our next President is a Republican, it will likely be undone. So, I dunno. If he does it, and it shows definitive statistical improvements, it's much much harder to get it undone. Like if pro gun laws are enacted, and shown to work, it's much harder to stop them, because there's both a precedent, and there's obvious, undeniable statistical evidence that any one can cite, with it being directly relevant to a discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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