Archetype Generator Meta

[Draconus297]

Your usage of Tyrant and Despot are both reliant on having multiple Tuners (an important thing to note is that you've opted to run 9, three of which are copies of Ghost Ogre that you're more likely to discard than use for Material) . . . and you don't have any way to bring your Tuners back once they've been used a single time.

 

Crystal Wing is also tricky to make in this Deck, requiring one of your unsearchable 2-of Catsith and a Level 7 Synchro, but one of those Synchro 7 you run is a copy of Black Rose, which you're probably using more as a field nuke than for the purpose of Synchro laddering; the other two are Blaster, whose effect is basically the same as being permanently equipped with Stella since you can't use its secondary effects (no Resonators or Red support) and Clear Wing.

 

This build is a glass cannon, emphasis on the glass. You need 1 or more Tuners and at least 3 Igknights in hand to make plays with on your first turn, because any other situation renders you entirely helpless for at least that turn. However, you have no way to search your necessary Tuners, or get them back after they've been used, meaning that losing any one of your bosses is all but game over right then and there outside chump-blocking with Igknights. If anything, I'd suggest some kind of revival card either to reuse your Tuners or get back dead Synchros for laddering purposes, preferably one that also increases consistency somehow- Salvation from the Grave and Step on Shadow fill this purpose, and it's really your decision whether you want the ability to cheaply block attacks and choose whatever monster you want in your Graveyard, or potentially getting back two Synchros and having a conditional effect negation. Remember: Not every single card in your Deck needs to be geared towards the challenge- I didn't ask for a pure Normal monster Deck in May, and during Anime Character Month I'm not going to demand people run the ace monsters of whatever character(s) they choose.

 

Unfortunately, unless a member vouches for you by pointing out a better combo play than Igknight stuff into PENDULUM SHOKAN, you will not succeed this month.

[Ἄργος Πανόπτης]

Welp, at least I tried... Good enough for me, next time I'll do better, now knowing what I need to do or not to do

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

Reminder for archetype queue

Majespecter (2/3 - Sakura, Nyx)
lswarm, bar Origin and Ophion (2/4 - Nyx, Dova)
Yosenju (2/3 - Sakura, Nyx)
Qli, bar Genius (2/3 - Dova, Sakura)
Lightsworn, bar Curious (1/3 - Kyumi)
Thunder Dragon (1/3 - Tinkerer) [awaiting full lineup]

 

---

 

And yeah, SOFU's already out and Thunder Dragons didn't get a Link (and no, Kaminari Summer Vacation doesn't count [or is even worth it]). Just going to reaffirm that I'm fine with letting them in. 

 

If they get a Link, then it'll have to wait until SAST (or w/e the abbreviation for Savage Strike will be). 

[Tinkerer]

Wanna nominate "Iron Chain" archetype.

 

...anyways, making literally 0 progress with Stompole. I'ma look for another prompt.

[Eshai]

Haven't been around in a while (and idk whats going on) so imma just say I made an archetype for the DPR that completely just didn't have Links. I will say they're more suited for Link Format since they aren't SSing enough to have room for many Links, but idk it should be fine. Dova could probably explain some of this if I don't explain it properly.

 

Shadenclave (Shade + Enclave, kinda means Ghost Empire but kinda not (Thesaurus is weird))

 

The main mechanic fundamentally is that if your monsters attack: You activate 1 of the targeted monster’s effect for your monster to activate.

That sounds strange and like it doesn't work as a main mechanic but hear me out

 

[spoiler: 2 examples]

 

They have 2 versions of the gimmick: "If you do:" and "If you cannot:"

The gimmick was never purely advantageous to copy an effect even if it did work, so it made it more interesting to choose attack targets during duels. Adding 2 different styles to the effects capitalizes on this and gives me more room to make these effects.

 

If you’re wondering about the PSCT, its so if you activate their effects outside of that monster’s battle, they still have uses.

 

Anyways, there's still the problem of them even using their main mechanic, so this is where the sub-type comes in

 

[spoiler: Subtype Example]

 

Spies

they SS to the opponent's field and to do a thing (pinnacle of creativity everyone). Despite the meh in creativity, it works really well for the archetype.

The Main mechanic is more like Diamond Dude in that it only copies effects. In this way, conditions and costs are ignored. This would mean that targeting effects can’t actually be copied with these, so that might be something to consider.

These guys have effects that can be copied when you attack them with the other monsters, so no matter your opponent’s Deck you’ll at least be able to still use your gimmick.

This does get crazy when you have a searcher that you can reactivate the effect of

 

[spoiler: Searcher that's abusable af]

 

There are some combos that just search out several cards per turn and its kinda nuts (insert Mist Body here), but tbh the cards that abuse these don’t see very much play so I don’t mind.

 

[spoiler: Finally, some boss monsters]

 

The Fusions are the only ones to have optional version of the main mechanic rather than the mandatory effects the main deck has, so they’re more flexible

 

There's also Catman over here

The Ninjas your opponent controls can build up, so the Fusions tend to help clear the board and activate a bunch of effects for advantage.

 

Well that was long. Thanks for reading. Here's the full Imgur: https://imgur.com/a/N7MdDzg

  

[Tinkerer]

@@Eshai

For better or worse, things have been extremely inactive here lately.  After looking at the archetype, for the most part, it looks fine, but... well, it kinda doesn't work as you described it.

 

The way you described it makes it sound as though, when you attack, you can immediately trigger one of the attack target's effects as though you control that monster.  It is a cool concept, but what your cards actually say is that they literally steal an effect.  Further, because the effect is "overwritten", they simply keep the effect and cannot overwrite it with anything else (i.e. your big boss fusion would only steal/use 1 effect even if it attacks 5 monsters).  Now, that is fine (if not bonkers in the right context *cough*attackingCannonSoldier*cough*) but due to how you made it sound, I assume that wasn't your intent.

 

I am no good at PSCT, but I think an immediate activation condition would work better than how it is worded.  I.e. instead of them saying: "This effect becomes...activated effects.", you could say something like: "activate 1 of the attack target's activated effects* as though you control that monster." ...or something.  Perhaps someone else could suggest a better way to write it out.

 

As it is, because of the current way they work, I cannot in good conscious let them into the AGM just because we do have lots of things that could be potentially loopy when used with these as they are.  If they are fixed to be more in-line with your stated intent, then yes, I'd be more than willing to push 'em in.

 

 

 

* I'd also strongly recommend you change "Activated effects" in the texts to "Ignition, Trigger, or Quick Effects", simply because those are terms that, while not really mentioned on the cards themselves, are official terms that leave things less ambiguous than "Activated Effects".

 

 

Anywhozzles, I think I'ma work on Black Gale from pg. 25

 

Black Gale

A set of WIND Fiends that are quite tricky. They focus on spinning themselves back into the Deck in order to bounce cards to the Hand and block out the Zones temporary. They also enjoy the light field in order to make direct attacks if their column is empty. Coupled with their direct-attack playstyle, they come equipped with an arsenal of equip spells that not only buffs their limited offensive capabilities, but search whenever the equipped monster is spun.

 

I've also got another archetype in the works, but I'm kinda still hoping for a look at my Powersink Archetype in terms of getting in the AGM.

[Draconus297]

Due to the modern theme being the default, I literally cannot read Eshai's post, so I'm gonna let the others talk in regards to whatever you said. Hopefully you didn't insult me or something in the midst of card discussion.

 

I'm busy all Friday, but I intend to look over Powersink on Saturday before my family tries to take me (a person who is put in physical agony by temperatures below ~65° F) to San Francisco.

[Eshai]

@@Eshai

For better or worse, things have been extremely inactive here lately.  After looking at the archetype, for the most part, it looks fine, but... well, it kinda doesn't work as you described it.

 

The way you described it makes it sound as though, when you attack, you can immediately trigger one of the attack target's effects as though you control that monster.  It is a cool concept, but what your cards actually say is that they literally steal an effect.  Further, because the effect is "overwritten", they simply keep the effect and cannot overwrite it with anything else (i.e. your big boss fusion would only steal/use 1 effect even if it attacks 5 monsters).  Now, that is fine (if not bonkers in the right context *cough*attackingCannonSoldier*cough*) but due to how you made it sound, I assume that wasn't your intent.

 

I am no good at PSCT, but I think an immediate activation condition would work better than how it is worded.  I.e. instead of them saying: "This effect becomes...activated effects.", you could say something like: "activate 1 of the attack target's activated effects* as though you control that monster." ...or something.  Perhaps someone else could suggest a better way to write it out.

 

As it is, because of the current way they work, I cannot in good conscious let them into the AGM just because we do have lots of things that could be potentially loopy when used with these as they are.  If they are fixed to be more in-line with your stated intent, then yes, I'd be more than willing to push 'em in.

 

 

 

* I'd also strongly recommend you change "Activated effects" in the texts to "Ignition, Trigger, or Quick Effects", simply because those are terms that, while not really mentioned on the cards themselves, are official terms that leave things less ambiguous than "Activated Effects".

@

 

Traptrix Rafflesia has a similar wording and the copying of that effect is only for that activation. This is due to it copying the effect and not the conditions or costs, so the next time it would attack it would just become a new effect. I got PSCT help from Azuriena and used the wordings of cards with similar effects, and as it stands the effect only becomes that effect during its initial activation. I've been learning a lot about PSCT over the months so that I can actually implement my gimmicks properly for these situations, but the fact that you didn't understand it tells me that the PSCT could be done better despite working properly in official terms.

 

Activated effects is just requiring that it has a colon ":". The effect is already limited in the kinds of effects in what it can do, most notably not being able to use archetypal effects and targeting effects. On top of that, it requires you to go into the Battle Phase before doing any of that stuff, so its fair.

 

If you make the PSCT "Activate" then the effects would include their costs, which would be a nerf in a lot of ways, for example not being able to copy Xyz or archetypal costs. Personally, I think the effect itself doesn't need nerfing, but I could use the wording for a couple other cards that don't require Battle Phase, so that might be fun.

 

As for Cannon Soldier, 1. most people don't run that, and 2, like I said before, its only copied during the initial activation, so it would just be 500 damage when the effect activates, and unless you're willing to attack that monster 16 times and have it somehow work, then its probably fine. It would probably be better to attack Amazoness Archer to their field with the Level 9 Fusion, but even then they do enough damage to probably wouldn't run it for the sake of consistency. If it was, it would be for OTK purposes, not the usual FTK shenanigans.

Due to the modern theme being the default, I literally cannot read Eshai's post, so I'm gonna let the others talk in regards to whatever you said. Hopefully you didn't insult me or something in the midst of card discussion.

 

Idk why you wouldn't be able to read it other than that I typed it into Google Docs first, and that the fonts themselves are that color rather than an adaptable color depending on the website themes. Imo you could just change it back to the old one (I still have the old version) but I'll try to adjust it.

[Tinkerer]

I suppose if there is in-game precedent for the effects to work as you say with that wording, then they are fine. I'd still recommend the change from "activated effects" to "ignition, trigger, or quick effects" at the very least for the sake of no ambiguity. However, since functionally the text is fine, I'd be willing to vouch for their addition.

[ChampionZero]

Hey AGM!

 

I regret to say that my time here as a member may well be up. I'll still be around on the website for roleplay and writing and the like, but given the direction the game's gone I've just fallen out of love with it. As well it's been so long since I worked on an archetype that any attempt would be going back to square one and that'll be frustrating for everyone involved. More importantly, I want to thank you guys for giving me a chance. I know it wasn't easy letting a total novice into the ranks, and my early work is definitely not as polished as all of yours, but I tried, and you guys made an effort to help me improve. You've been good to me, and I've done my best to be good to all of you. Hopefully I leave behind a few good memories (and at least one half-decent archetype) for you guys. Thanks for everything, you guys.

 

Don't be a stranger!

~ChampionZero Elijah

[Dova]

It was a pleasure working with you ChampionZero! Hopefully you stick around the site even if you do leave the AGM, but if you don't, hopefully you have fun doing whatever else piques you interest after this atrocity Yu-Gi-Oh.

 

 

I know I myself haven't been active around here lately, but I've just been lazy, and really do want to get back into cardmaking at some point in the future. (Look, more procastinating :thinking:)

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

I've generally been lazy with cardmaking for a few reasons lately:

- I was sick last week, so...yeah, I gotta rest

- Handling other stuff offsite

- Procrastination on design 

- Archetype games (well, I guess that I am still designing stuff so to speak; just not in the AGM)

 

As for Zero, it sucks to see you go but yeah, Yugioh has changed over the years and obviously Link format hasn't sat well with a few of you in here. But I guess I'll see you around elsewhere, though probably not in Custom Cards (even though there is a Legacy option for MR3, which was/is still somewhat directed towards us in here). 

 

---

 

Oh right, and it's about that time where Draco needs to roll out the August challenge.

[The Nyx Avatar]

Hey AGM!

 

I regret to say that my time here as a member may well be up. I'll still be around on the website for roleplay and writing and the like, but given the direction the game's gone I've just fallen out of love with it. As well it's been so long since I worked on an archetype that any attempt would be going back to square one and that'll be frustrating for everyone involved. More importantly, I want to thank you guys for giving me a chance. I know it wasn't easy letting a total novice into the ranks, and my early work is definitely not as polished as all of yours, but I tried, and you guys made an effort to help me improve. You've been good to me, and I've done my best to be good to all of you. Hopefully I leave behind a few good memories (and at least one half-decent archetype) for you guys. Thanks for everything, you guys.

 

Don't be a stranger!

~ChampionZero Elijah

Well, see ya man. Best of luck to you.

 

Also, I should have said this back in Saturday afternoon and from some of my recent topics it speaks for itself. But I'm back.

 

No project right now. Should look back at the Archetype Game.

[Tinkerer]

So it has been a few months since I'd brought this up the first time, but it is still something that I am hoping to make a thing in the AGM.
 

Meantime, I had a design idea for something that's a nigh untouched mechanic (completely untouched in the irl game). It should be a simple idea, but it changes the idea of the game state itself.

[spoiler=Example card + Idea]
Duelist's Battle Spirit
Continuous Spell
Twice per turn you can tribute 1 monster. Place Counters on this card equal to the tributed monster's Level/Rank. You gain ATK equal to the number of Counters on this card x 100. You can declare 1 additional attack during your Battle Phase.

I mean, in the AGM, we have the ability to place counters on yourself so mechanically you - the player - can be part of the game.

Mechanicwise, these are the implications:

• The player has 0 ATK and, initially, cannot declare any attacks.
• LP during battles with players functions exactly the same as two battling monsters. (i.e. If you have 300 ATK and your opponent attacks directly with a 1000 ATK monster, you take 700 damage)
• You cannot be destroyed/banished.
• You are never treated as being on the field.
• You do not have a DEF value and you cannot be placed in defense position.
• You do not have a Level/Rank (Maybe? I mean, we can run with mechanics involving having your own Level/Rank - which could open up worlds of possibility - but the player having none would simplify things.)
• You do not have a type/Attribute (Maybe? See above parentheses.)
• You can attack your opponent directly.
• You are not a Monster, Spell, or Trap.
• You are unaffected by all card effects that don't specify you specifically.
• You have no effects.

Because of how this works, I'd think a keyword might be necessary, because it would get confusing determining what effects are working on "you" the player specifically or "you" the player generally ("You can declare 1 additional attack during your Battle Phase" - you the player or the monsters you control?).

Yay or nay? Any keyword suggestions?

...From the initial concept, I've really only thought of 2 addendums.

Firstly, the keyword should simply be "You" with a capital "Y" to signify that it is specifically referencing the duelist.

...and second, battle damage between battling monsters is also reduced by player ATK (I.e. if a 1000 ATK monster attacks a 500 ATK monster and the player has 200 ATK, the player only takes a resulting 300 damage total). I believe this was implied, but it wasn't outrightly stated. No one takes excess battle damage if player ATK is higher than the damage (I.e. if, in the above example the player had 600 ATK, there would be no damage to either player. The 500 ATK monster would be destroyed as normal).


...I have a bunch of generics lined up for this concept and I still don't see anything that'd be conflicting with it, but I don't wanna shoehorn it in if it's something you peeps really don't want.

[Dova]

I'm really torn. On the one hand, I do kinda like the concept, as it's a pretty interesting way of expanding the game while not adding bunches of new cards and mechanics. Working of what we already have, you know? On the other hand, it could be kind of confusing, as by simply capitalizing you doesn't fix the potential confusion raised in that example sentence from your original post, and...well, this implementation is very deep in mechanics for want of a better word. It changes something fundamental without really changing it, and I don't know how I feel about it.

 

I'm not against it, so I won't complain if other people support it and it is eventually introduced, but I can't directly support it for the moment.

[Draconus297]

Sorry about my recent lack of activity! I've been camping a bit further north than San Francisco, in the redwood forests. Stable Internet is rare up here, but I'll be back to regular posting (including my list of monthly prompts) by tomorrow morning.

 

Apologies for the inconvenience!

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

Ah right, I forgot you were camping.

 

Nothing really happened while you were gone, save for maybe the usual,

[Draconus297]

August

For the third anniversary of the AGM, here's a bit of fun: Three-ofs! Treat the entire Semi-Limited list on down as being completely banned, and any card you're not running a full complement of needs to be sufficiently searchable to pose as a 3-of (for example, if you don't feel like using 3 copies of your Field Spell, you can fill in necessary space with a copy or two of Terraforming).

[Tinkerer]

If Sakura doesn't mind, I'd like to request adding his Swordstalker cards from the Single/Archetype thread. Regardless, I'd like to add the OG Swordstalker to the AGM pool.

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

I'll approve of it, though to be fair, I did have to pull that one out of thin air somewhat after editing. 

 

If you guys want to request the other ones, go ahead (well, bar the Nettles and Mare Mare ones because those DO have Link Monsters).

[Draconus297]

On the topic of Swordstalker, if anyone has any interesting Labyrinth Dragon targets (Normals with 1500 or less ATK) that they've either made or seen, I recommend their addition. High DEF or points of interest in the form of specific Attribute/Type combinations or statlines (Sorcery Hydras like 1000/0, Fungal Serpents work with anything that is at least 2 of EARTH, Reptile, and 2900 combined stats, Rekindling targets, I think we might have Tour Guide, etc.) are recommended as a matter of course, but aren't necessary if you just like a monster's art or lore.

 

Also, I'm mostly done with Immolancients, in case anyone wants to give them a look.

[Tinkerer]

Finished Black Gale: https://forum.yugiohcardmaker.net/topic/374605-black-gale-written-agm/

 

By the by, what's the queue looking like?

 

I'm really torn. On the one hand, I do kinda like the concept, as it's a pretty interesting way of expanding the game while not adding bunches of new cards and mechanics. Working of what we already have, you know? On the other hand, it could be kind of confusing, as by simply capitalizing you doesn't fix the potential confusion raised in that example sentence from your original post, and...well, this implementation is very deep in mechanics for want of a better word. It changes something fundamental without really changing it, and I don't know how I feel about it.

 

I'm not against it, so I won't complain if other people support it and it is eventually introduced, but I can't directly support it for the moment.

 

Mm.  Yeah, I guess..

 

If it makes things any better for anyone, the thought process for the mechanic was actually not: "I'ma make a new mechanic", it was more: "let me return to the root of the game and take an alternative natural progression."  Duel Monsters, in its original incarnation, was you (the duelist) being some type of master wizard summoning monsters and flinging around powerful magics, right?  If the game kept that concept in mind, wouldn't it make sense for there to be a means of, you know, actually engaging in this combat yourself?

 

I simply wanted to bring that progression to life since we do have the idea of counters being placed on players (a player interaction mechanic that could be explained/expanded on using the player ATK mechanic).

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

Reminder for archetype queue

 

Majespecter (2/3 - Sakura, Nyx)

lswarm, bar Origin and Ophion (2/4 - Nyx, Dova)

Yosenju (2/3 - Sakura, Nyx)

Qli, bar Genius (2/3 - Dova, Sakura)

Lightsworn, bar Curious (1/3 - Kyumi)

Thunder Dragon (2/3 - Tinkerer, Sakura)

 

As much as I want to request Mayakashi, you would have to exclude Gashadokuro and Yuki-onna because former references a Link Monster in its effect and latter actually is a Link. But then again, Gashadokuro kinda sucks though.

[Draconus297]

Turns out we severely underestimated Thunder Dragons. They're a meta contender in the OCG, and anything that can compete effectively in the modern game is probably overwhelming for the AGM.

 

I'd recommend Valkyries, but given that no one else brought them up I suppose I can assume no one else likes them.

[Flash Flyer - Sakura]

Here's the thing though; OCG has a different banlist than TCG (which the majority of us are players in) and though they might be screwing sheet over there; TCG is another story. Though, it might help if I actually look on YGOPro / Dueling Book for TCG decks, but since we won't get them until November here, well, you'll have to go mixed. 

 

For our purposes, well, just adapt to stuff, I suppose. 

 

---

 

I'd be okay with Valkyries, but Time Goddess may be problematic. But then again, we ban that and Ride is somewhat useless. 

 

Then again, I can't say that I'm impressed with some of the legacy support certain members have made for them in the Legacy game threads (and a few other vets aren't either). Let's do better.