Super Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U

[Toffee.]

So... Some people are speculating and/or claiming these is Sonic's alternate costumes:


I could actually see them doing this, considering Sonic's costumes in Brawl were just subtle differences, and hardly made it that much of a thing.
Plus, the yellow one can be pawned off as Tails Super Sonic.

Also, I thought these were pretty cool:
[spoiler=Protoman]
[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Bass]
[/spoiler]

[Tentacruel]

 

 

I'd be more inclined to take Pokémon as more important if they'd consistently make core Pokémon games for their home consoles. The Wii basically had nothing. Battle Revolution was boring. XD and Colosseum were both critically mediocre, with only the original really showcasing the kind of power Pokémon can put into a console sales-wise. Besides Other M , Metroid's been generally great on both home consoles and handhelds, even if it doesn't sell as amazingly. Metroid, Super Metroid, Metroid Prime, 2, 3, Metroid II, Fusion, Hunters. (with the last garnering the exact same criticisms that Kid Icarus Uprising got due to similar controls)

 

That's personal bias though.  Pokemon is, at it's core, a handheld series.  Making core entries for home consoles would devalue that. 

[DL]

Didnt Zero come before Protoman though?


Also if those are his alternate costumes that will be so great.

 

The other colors were great but these fulfill like FIVE OTHER CHARACERS

 

Knuckles, Shadow, Super Sonic, Jet AND Silver.

[Agro]

That's personal bias though.  Pokemon is, at it's core, a handheld series.  Making core entries for home consoles would devalue that.

Well there is a reason I said "I'd be more inclined..." instead of just saying that's how things were.
 
Though I'd disagree making core entries on home consoles would devalue anything, especially if done well.

So... Some people are speculating and/or claiming these is Sonic's alternate costumes:

CLEARLY needs more scarves.

[Tentacruel]

Well there is a reason I said "I'd be more inclined..." instead of just saying that's how things were.
 
Though I'd disagree making core entries on home consoles would devalue anything, especially if done well.
 

 

It's a case of the console version being considered the "real" version and what not, as is the case with most games that have handheld and console versions.

 

I'd be fine with more Colosseum type games.  A proper Pokemon game, but different than the main series.  I feel like that style was more suited to consoles anyway. 

[Flame Dragon]

I don't think you understand what I was saying. Importance does not equal sales. Besides maybe Red/Blue, which did something on such a small cartridge that no one thought was possible, Super Metroid and Metroid Prime are two of the most influential games ever made. The prior more then the later, clearly, although Prime was absolutely impressive in how seamlessly it brought the franchise into 3D. Super Metroid is widely considered to be a masterpiece of game design, and has been so influential that it invented its own genre (you still see the irreverence to it in games like Guacamelee).
 
Pokémon Red & Blue was far from a perfect game, it had balancing issues with things like wrap, fire spin, and the psychic type. Plus there were a whole bunch of glitches. (I'm sure you remember all the crazy things that can happen by simply surfing along Cinnabar Island.) It's been wildly popular, but I disagree that it's been more influential to the game industry than Metroid has.
 
I'd be more inclined to take Pokémon as more important if they'd consistently make core Pokémon games for their home consoles. The Wii basically had nothing. Battle Revolution was boring. XD and Colosseum were both critically mediocre, with only the original really showcasing the kind of power Pokémon can put into a console sales-wise. Besides Other M , Metroid's been generally great on both home consoles and handhelds, even if it doesn't sell as amazingly. Metroid, Super Metroid, Metroid Prime, 2, 3, Metroid II, Fusion, Hunters. (with the last garnering the exact same criticisms that Kid Icarus Uprising got due to similar controls)

I tihnk the issue is that we are talking about different kinds of importance. While sales are certainly something I care about, my main focus is how Nintendo as a company would feel about the franchises. Pokemon is one of the most important an assest it has (even ignoring all the extra that have come from it) and I feel that it would be in another tier compaired to Metroid. Your bringing up influance on the gaming industry, and while it certainly does have that, it is something I don't put much weight into when I think about how important it is to Nintendo or big a franchise it is.  

 

 

Anyway, to bring this back to Smash, how would you tier the Nintendo franchises? For me

Tier 1: Mario, Pokemon, Zelda

Tier 2: Metroid, Kirby, Donkey Kong, 

Tier 3: Fire Emblem, Wario, Star Fox

Tier 4: Yoshi, Kid Icarus, F-Zero, Mother

 

Use what ever rating system you want. I used what it means to Nintendo and what are they doing with the franchise now. Personally, after FE it kind of drops off and the only reason I have it where it is because I don't think it has quite as much importance as the other Tier 2 franchises.

[Toffee.]

CLEARLY needs more scarves.

And also more leg.

[Agro]

It's a case of the console version being considered the "real" version and what not, as is the case with most games that have handheld and console versions.

Yeah, but that view has been generally frowned upon. Especially with more recent iterations what with Link Between Worlds, Fire Emblem Awakening, & Luigi's Mansion all being arguably better than their console brethren. (same for indies and downloadables, too w/ Gone Home, Papers, Please, and Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons)

I'd certainly hope people don't devalue Pokémon's handheld games even if they make a great console game. Although to really make a great console game, they'll need to really step it all up with the online multiplayer support.

[Shradow]

In that Bass version of the Final Smash image, who's the one on the far right?

[Tentacruel]

Yeah, but that view has been generally frowned upon. Especially with more recent iterations what with Link Between Worlds, Fire Emblem Awakening, & Luigi's Mansion all being arguably better than their console brethren. (same for indies and downloadables, too w/ Gone Home, Papers, Please, and Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons)

I'd certainly hope people don't devalue Pokémon's handheld games even if they make a great console game. Although to really make a great console game, they'll need to really step it all up with the online multiplayer support.

 

As long as it wasn't just a port of an existing game but a different version for consoles. 

[Agro]

Use what ever rating system you want. I used what it means to Nintendo and what are they doing with the franchise now. Personally, after FE it kind of drops off and the only reason I have it where it is because I don't think it has quite as much importance as the other Tier 2 franchises.

I mean, Nintendo only considers something important if it sells. So that's part of the divisiveness on this issue between us.

Commerically, it's part of the Big 3. Critically, Metroid is. Although it's kind of weird cuz in that sense, Pokémon is just kind of seen as it's own thing, not necessarily less than Metroid, Mario, Zelda, but just not thought of as a "core" franchise.

In that Bass version of the Final Smash image, who's the one on the far right?

Final Boss of Legends 1, I believe.
 
 

As long as it wasn't just a port of an existing game but a different version for consoles.

Well of course!

[Tentacruel]

I mean, Nintendo only considers something important if it sells. So that's part of the divisiveness on this issue between us.

Commerically, it's part of the Big 3. Critically, Metroid is. Although it's kind of weird cuz in that sense, Pokémon is just kind of seen as it's own thing, not necessarily less than Metroid, Mario, Zelda, but just not thought of as a "core" franchise.
Final Boss of Legends 1, I believe.
 
 
Well of course!

Okay, so now we're on the same page.  

 

As far as what Pokemon is, I'd say it's definitely just it's own thing.  Like some freakishly large niche.  

 

Critically, I feel a lot of reviewers have no business reviewing a Pokemon game.   A lot of complaints in most reviews I've read are "It's still Pokemon."  Like, no shit. 

[Agro]

Which is hilarious, because whenever I try to sell someone on a new pokemon game, I'm always like "It's still Pokémon, buy that s***"

And also more leg.

The constant sexualization of Sonic has to stop.

[Shradow]

The constant sexualization of Sonic has to stop.

 

Right? They never even have him wear any pants!

[Neochu-H]

Right? They never even have him wear any pants!

 

 

yeh instead lets make rouge nude and go frum ther

[Blake]

Tier 3: Fire Emblem...after FE it kind of drops off and the only reason I have it where it is because I don't think it has quite as much importance as the other Tier 2 franchises.

Just wanted to elaborate here.

 

For the most part, pre-Awakening, FE fans are an almost cult following of the games. They're not bad or anything, and the fans are generally appreciative, but it was really niche.

 

Less so in Japan, where it's more of a staple series, but internationally it wasn't released until 7... so most fans that got into it over here are BECAUSE of Smash Bros. That said, anyone that picked up the games loved them, so it was just kind of an inclusive fanclub, so to speak. Those who were in were in, and those who weren't weren't. No one was outright barred, it just boiled down to who found their way there.

 

I'd say to Nintendo it's probably higher than Donkey Kong, more akin to Metroid, but internationally you're correct.

 

also i want the rumors to be false because lucina deserves it more than chrom >=

[Agro]

Just wanted to elaborate here.

 

For the most part, pre-Awakening, FE fans are an almost cult following of the games. They're not bad or anything, and the fans are generally appreciative, but it was really niche.

 

Less so in Japan, where it's more of a staple series, but internationally it wasn't released until 7... so most fans that got into it over here are BECAUSE of Smash Bros. That said, anyone that picked up the games loved them, so it was just kind of an inclusive fanclub, so to speak. Those who were in were in, and those who weren't weren't. No one was outright barred, it just boiled down to who found their way there.

 

I'd say to Nintendo it's probably higher than Donkey Kong, more akin to Metroid, but internationally you're correct.

 

also i want the rumors to be false because lucina deserves it more than chrom >=

Awakening's success is partly great grassroots marketing through word-of-mouth and reviews, and probably even more just narrowcasting doing it's job spectacularly. (for those who don't know what narrowcasting is: targeting a more niche audience to gain an identity; it's worked really well in cable TV to get large fanbases for what most would expect to be niche-type shows)

 

I think if Lucina ends up in it, she's definitely going to be a skin for Marth. I just don't want Chrom because, UGH, no more swords.

[Shradow]

The only other swordsman I imagine getting in is Samurai Goroh, because his style would be so different from any other swordsman. But he's already an AT, so :(.

[DL]

Im still waiting for Chrom to be a character and Lucina to be a Marth alternate costume.

 

 

Then suddenly Nintendo trolls us by revealing the Marth they showed was actually just a skin of LUCINA

 

 

Also if they added anyone else, they could add one of the important mages of the series, but thatd be too much like Zelda.

 

If it was a FE villain, Validar is certainly an option, though the orange haired trickster is good too...forgot his name.

The crazy one.

 

 

 

If not Chrom, I want it to be Soren.

 

Or Gaius.

 

Hell, they might add SOTHE.

 

IDK, anyone they add will make me happy.

[Tourmaline]

Man they should really add Tharja as the next character because Fire Emblem needs a magic-using character in SSB. Not to mention a female one, at that, which Lucina being a skin would fulfill.

Honestly, Black, Lucina is not nearly the main protagonist of Awakening (Chrom/Robin/Lucina in descending order), and a costume plus voiceover would do her role justice.

[Shradow]

The only other Fire Emblem character I really want (aside from Ike returning) is the Black Knight, but he's not likely.

[Agro]

Then suddenly Nintendo trolls us by revealing the Marth they showed was actually just a skin of LUCINA

... I didn't realize I needed this till now. I NEED THIS.

Actually, do we have video of Marth in action? Or has he only been shown in images so far? Cuz I'd jump on board this conspiracy in a heartbeat.
 

Nevermind, immediately see him in the Greninja trailer. Still, him being a skin would be an amazing troll on Sakurai's part. I'm all for this conspiracy.

 

Also if they added anyone else, they could add one of the important mages of the series, but thatd be too much like Zelda.

If it was a FE villain, Validar is certainly an option, though the orange haired trickster is good too...forgot his name.
The crazy one.
 
If not Chrom, I want it to be Soren.
 
Or Gaius.
 
Hell, they might add SOTHE.
 
IDK, anyone they add will make me happy.

Or... Robin, your avatar in FE:A? I mean, it makes more sense than any of the side-characters. Give you the sword AND the magic from the Grandmaster class.

[DL]

Yeah but....the reason I dont wanna say Robin is because Robin has no set APPEARANCE....so IDK how customizeable he'd be....

 

 

And we also saw Wario with HIS alternate costume in the Smash Bros trailer XP

 

 

Or was his NORMAL outfit his alt?

[Agro]

I'd think if they did robin, they'd put his/her hood up like they do in all of the cutscenes.

[Shradow]

Or was his NORMAL outfit his alt?

 

Yes, his standard outfit in Brawl was his WarioWare attire. Classic overalls was his alternate costume.