Shradow Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 BowserUp Special 1/2/3Can grab ledges from behind Hell yes. Also, loving the Ganondorf stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherz Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 December 16, 2015 Dear Gertrude, It has been a long and cold winter. Every morning I wake up freezing, the third floor of my house now has icicles growing from it. However, I make the trek up there everyday, to play Zelda. As stated before, its been a long winter. Finally, our Lord and Savior Sakurai has released the patch notes for smash. This was the day I was waiting for. I disregarded all other balance changes, and scrolled to the bottom, feverishly awaiting the name 'Zelda' to appear. Little did I know, I would be condemned by the 'no change' awaiting my eyes. Now I realize there is no love for Zelda mains. Dearest Gertrude, I will await another months, praying to Sakurai to give Zelda something to compete. -With Love,Cherzsrsly tho with Bayonetta coming out I think I'm going to need a secondary D= Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Decreased landing lag on all of Shulk's aerials is always nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmo. Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 More Zelda love is necessary, she has so much potential. Maybe increase the damage of some of her spells a bit, or make her not have as much open time after or before attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Progenitor Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 It should also be noted that Mewtwo's Neutral Aerial no longer forces the foe into traditional landing if it is Fast Fallen before the final hit. It's a bit difficult to explain, but the opponent will maintain their shifting momentum from inside the multi-hit, and be pushed away on landing, if only slightly. It feels weirder than it actually looks. While that kinda sucks as it eliminates a lot of combo options, his changes to Confusion and Down Throw are HUGE. Down-Throw -> Forward Tilt is true on midweights at right around 0.Fair is a viable followup through 20-40Nair and U-Air can potentially followup from 20-50, depending on DI Confusion -> Fair is, and is always, true if you are fast enough on the input. The only way to escape it that I've seen is an extremely fast move with a lot of priority, like Mario's Up + B, or simply Jumping if you were a bit too slow. I've found no other options to disrupt this. Airdodge, fastfalling, teching, slower moves. All of them useless. With this Mewtwo has a viable combo starter and killing tool at any percent that goes through shields. Not only that, but as seen with Flame Choke, Confusion's box of influence seems to be much less precise, meaning it's radius is subsequently much bigger, and always pulls them to the heart of the move while they spin. This sheet is literally nuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Βyakuya Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Notes taken about Cloud so far: -His Neutral Air is one of his best assault moves other than his Side Air, which has considerable startup lag. The Side Air has a sweet spot meteor though, so that's cool. His Neutral is good for some defensive plays as well, and the hitbox starts vertically.-Up Smash has low launch power at most percents so it can initiate some combos. Up Tilt also a combo starter.-Jab Combo has similar properties as Shulk's but seems a bit more jankier.-Side Smash is incredibly powerful but has lot of lag which leaves you to be punished if they shield.-His moves are often powerful that combos are very hard to initiate on the ground. His Up Air is pretty good though, compared to his Neutral and Side. His Side and Down Air can do meteors. Down Air is also a fair move to use in a fastfall attack as well.-Neutral B has a very huge range. Good for ledge pressure.-Side B is a gimmick, but is a very good shield pressure tool.-Up B is incredibly powerful, but not as flexible as Kirby's Final Cutter.-Down B is a reliable move to charge during dizzy situations as well as just being idle. Charged Down B Special near the ledge can lead up to baiting potential. If opp has high percentage, short hop in with full Down B can kill.-Down Tilt is a reliable move can hit from a fair range and can be followed with a Dash Attack, Tilt, or Jab Combo after, but it won't link normally.-Side Tilt only does some damage and knockback, but won't stun opp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shradow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Ok, not sure if everyone knows this yet so I thought I'd share since I only just figured it out, but the downward slash on Climhazzard only grabs ledges if you've fallen a certain distance first. Also Cloud makes Little Macs trying to recover cry. Yay for Cloud techs already: http://smashboards.com/threads/cloud-instant-liimit-break-cancel-ilbc.425982/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake the Sage Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 I've been playing Cloud a bit as well and, well, his Charged Down B can kill at at least 50% if you are close enough to the edges. And like they said no matter where you are at 100% it kills automatically. And yeah, his Side B is a gimmick that doesn't work all that well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shradow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/3x5ib0/clouds_finishing_touch_kill_percents/ Finishing Touch kill percent is primarily based on fall speed, it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 I've been playing Cloud a bit as well and, well, his Charged Down B can kill at at least 50% if you are close enough to the edges. And like they said no matter where you are at 100% it kills automatically. And yeah, his Side B is a gimmick that doesn't work all that well. I've liked the Side B when you have limit break, but other than that it seems pretty bad. Good chance it gets fiddled with a little when the last characters come out. https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/3x5ib0/clouds_finishing_touch_kill_percents/ Finishing Touch kill percent is primarily based on fall speed, it seems. Wow, Fox falls fast. And wow, those are some low number. Thats pretty scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Progenitor Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 I dunno what you guys are talking about. Down Throw > Cross Slash is a 0 -> 27% true combo against all characters. 36% if you had limit break. For combo purposes use Up and Down tilt combined with Nair to string your opponent across the stage. Don't stale Up Air, as tempting as it may be. Move is crazy strong at kill percent. However Cloud has a really solid falling Up Air, which can combo into a plethora of options. At EXTREMELY low percents, Cloud's F-Tilt can Jab Lock. I'm talkin like under 15% here. As of right now Cloud doesn't actually have a way to make use of that other than hitting a charizard who Flare Blitzed at zero, but maybe you can do some throw shenanigans on Battlefield platforms Need to test it out later. F-Tilt to Fair is a fantastic way to set up the spike, especially if they jump into it. Same with Nair to Fair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 So never really thought about it but anyone else bothered that Charizard in game is basically meant to be a fast special attacker and yet....in Smash not that at all? Anyway. Bayo, eh, not interested really in her in general and think she's a weird choice.Corrin...As the FE guy of YCM. here at least, apparently...idk. Kinda cool but I would've liked to grow attached to the character first. Plus like...we get it, main characters, but like there's a huge roster that didn't make it in... Speaking of which. To the "FE having a lot of reps" thing. Remember that.1.) Not many assist trophies, or items, which I think the other games have more of in here.2.) There are like, one character from several of the games. Meaning, each FE game (mostly) has a large, and different, roster. So it seems logical to include more characters in Smash...though sad that none from 7 or 8 are in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shradow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 So never really thought about it but anyone else bothered that Charizard in game is basically meant to be a fast special attacker and yet....in Smash not that at all? Not really, there are tons of characters who aren't realistic to their own game series. Captain Falcon only races and has never even fought within his own games, Ike is a speedster with high skill and only average strength in PoR/RD, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 I dunno what you guys are talking about. Down Throw > Cross Slash is a 0 -> 27% true combo against all characters. 36% if you had limit break. I've actually had people pop out of the move before. Maybe its just better at low percents? Speaking of which. To the "FE having a lot of reps" thing. Remember that. 1.) Not many assist trophies, or items, which I think the other games have more of in here. 2.) There are like, one character from several of the games. Meaning, each FE game (mostly) has a large, and different, roster. So it seems logical to include more characters in Smash...though sad that none from 7 or 8 are in. 1) Not really. DK has 0 and Star Fox has 1. Most have 2. Plus items and AT REALLY don't equate to a full playable character. 2) The issue isn't can Fire Emblem have more rep. Of course it can, every franchise could easily support more characters. The issue is does it deserve it. Lets break that down. 1) Before Awakening came out, FE was literally dying. I've ranked Nintendo's franchise before, and at that point it was likely C tier. Had Awakening not done well that would have been the end of franchise. To go from that to 6 reps in Smash, one of the biggest franchises for Nintendo in 3 years is astonishing. Thats part of the problem, it growth has been super fast so a lot of people don't realize it should have more reps. But, that leads to the other problem. 2) Even with it being as big as it is, it still isn't 6 characters big. I'd put it around DK, Kirby, Metroid, and Star Fox in terms of placement for Nintendo now. I personally think 3 is the correct number for those franchise, and I could see them getting a 4th. I'd certainly be ok with FE having a 4th. The thing is 5+ really is where Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda should be. The ultimate problem is this, a DLC character should be super hype. Every character should be someone that fans had demanded and actually seeing them get in should be a moment of pure joy. Corrin doesn't have that. Most people didn't want him to be in. Most people wouldn't have even thought to ask for him. Largely due to his game not being out in most the world. You could argue its to promote the game, and fine, thats Nintendo's choice, but that shouldn't be what a DLC character is. You want them to be exciting, the general reaction here is, "meh". This isn't helped by them having had a player poll that they easily could have drawn from to see who it was that players most wanted and would have caused giant reactions. That being said, I think its important to note WHY we have 6. Specifically, Lucina and Roy. Lucina is a clone and Sakurai included her because they had the model and only needed to small changes. Roy got in because players are weird and really wanted Roy back. FE has two extraneous characters and its them, not Corrin, and when you look at why they are there, its like fine w/e. I like Corrin. He looks super cool and very different from the other FE characters. I'd rather him to Wolf, but I think Wolf makes a TON more sense to be in the game. I think a lot of characters should have gotten in over him. And I think that giving one of the last two DLC slots to a character that isn't going to send the hype train in another universe isn't how you should use DLC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Well as I said. With the other franchises you can easily put only a few characters in and have a majority of the important characters throughout all the games.FE doesn't have that, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Well as I said. With the other franchises you can easily put only a few characters in and have a majority of the important characters throughout all the games.FE doesn't have that, really. Thats not what important though. The main two conditions I feel should get a character into Smash are. 1) They need to be a popular and iconic for their franchise. 2) They need to be distinct and bring something interesting to the roster. How many character truthfully meet both conditions? My understanding is Roy, while popular because of Smash, isn't popular in his actual franchise. Lucina or Chrom might be popular, but they aren't really distinct from either Marth or Ike. One that note, its why I like Corrin and Robin for FE since they are so different from those two. I also like the idea of having the avatar character be the representative. Using another example, K. Rool is popular, the first major bad guy for DK, and I think they could do something really with his movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Honestly what they should have done was pull a Bowser Jr, make Lucina a costume for Marth (and masked Lucina) and then put a villain from FE into the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Honestly what they should have done was pull a Bowser Jr, make Lucina a costume for Marth (and masked Lucina) and then put a villain from FE into the roster. Which I'd be all for. I named her as one of the reason Corrin has had such a poor reception. Villains honestly aren't as popular as heroes which is why Smash has so few. I mean, of the 56 total characters, only like 3 are full on villains. Wario, Meta Knight, Dedede, and Dark Pit might be antagonists, but not full on villain like Bowser, Bowser Jr., or Ganon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Which I'd be all for. I named her as one of the reason Corrin has had such a poor reception. Villains honestly aren't as popular as heroes which is why Smash has so few. I mean, of the 56 total characters, only like 3 are full on villains. Wario, Meta Knight, Dedede, and Dark Pit might be antagonists, but not full on villain like Bowser, Bowser Jr., or Ganon.It's sad cause FE has a host of good potential villains to use....Now I depressed myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shradow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 You understand correctly, FD, Smash is Roy's saving grace. As a FE Lord he's generally considered the worst of the worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Which is why my rule is that they need to be iconic to their franchise on top of being popular. Jigglypuff has the same problem in that the reason people want her in Smash is because she's been in Smash for so long. That doesn't change the fact that as a representative for the Pokemon franchise she REALLY isn't a good choice. Though at least she was once popular, unlike Roy who only got in because they wanted to promote his game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airride Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Which is why my rule is that they need to be iconic to their franchise on top of being popular. Jigglypuff has the same problem in that the reason people want her in Smash is because she's been in Smash for so long. That doesn't change the fact that as a representative for the Pokemon franchise she REALLY isn't a good choice. Though at least she was once popular, unlike Roy who only got in because they wanted to promote his game.being fair with jig - she's kind of the obligatory "joke" character, with how rest works, her amusingly bad up special, and other things. Closest we have to a joke character, at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Good lord is Cloud super predictable online. It's easy to read what he does before he even does it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 being fair with jig - she's kind of the obligatory "joke" character, with how rest works, her amusingly bad up special, and other things. Closest we have to a joke character, at least. I don't even buy that. Duck Hunt, Wario and G&W to a lesser degree all fill that role better. Only the retro ones work because Sakurai likes his throw back characters and they DO have a place in the roster and Wario IS a stooge character. Jig's Down-B is also one of her better moves, and her recovery is one of the best so a bad Up-B isn't really an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shradow Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 I want more songs on Midgar. At least give us One Winged Angel or J-E-N-O-V-A, Sakurai. D: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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