Expelsword Posted September 1, 2012 Report Share Posted September 1, 2012 This is a match I've been wondering about, but since most people haven't played Star Ocean, it's admittedly not likely to generate much discussion, in fact, I'm not even sure of much of their capabilities... Round 1: Halo: No Halos Star Ocean: No Creation Energy Round 2: Halo: No Halos ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I [i]think[/i] Star Ocean's ships still outclass Halo's without Creation Energy, and, I believe Halo uses mostly balistic weapons, but someone more knowledgable about Halo should elaborate on it. Round 2 should be easy for the Earth Federation, Creation Energy is somewhere around easy moon level destruction, but I dunno, maybe Halo can win. *I should elaborate that this is a space battle, [i]not [/i]a ground war, SPARTANS are mostly irrelevant.* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 4, 2012 Report Share Posted September 4, 2012 I know absolutely NOTHING about Star Ocean or anything about it. Halo, however, I should be able to help with. ...I can't really say anything as of now, since I have no knowledge about the enemy. However, as for what you pondered... depends. For the UNSC, yes. The Ballistic weapons, to my knowledge, could be anything from the 50mm Point Defense guns to the Magnetic Accelerator Cannons...if you count 600 tons of ferric Tungsten or depleted Uranium hurling towards you at 30,000 meters per second ballistic. They also use Shiva-Class Nuclear Missiles and Archer Missile pods, since the Point Defense guns are usually only used for anti-fighter purposes or last ditch defense. However, the Covenant almost universally use Plasma-based weaponry for their ships. I suppose they may use missiles at times, but I can't really remember. Speaking of, you never really specified which faction the Star Ocean...dudes...were fighting. UNSC? Covenant? Both? And what about location? Is it at a Star Ocean Planet? A UNSC or Covenant Planet? Out in the middle of nowheresville? Because if it's a UNSC planet...y'all better be on the lookout for Super MACs. Nothing will put a damper on your spirits like 3,000 tons of ferric Tungsten cutting a hole clean through your ship at 1/4 the speed of light. The 5 second reload speed is also a plus. Details, man! We can't have these discussions without details! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 When I imagined this I figured it would be a verse-wide battle, everyone good and bad in Star Ocean vs. everyone in Halo in a space battle. Perhaps I should narrow it though, Earth Federation vs. Covenant or UNSC, maybe. Gonna fix this up a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 No need to narrow it. I was just wondering. Anyway, I came up with this strategy for the Halo Team on a whim. While the Covenant have far more advanced technology, such as shielding and plasma weapons, the UNSC still manage to outrank their firepower with the MACs they use. So, the Covenant with CAS-Class Assault Carriers and CSO-Class Supercarriers (plus smaller vessels they would launch) would probably spearhead, distracting the enemy forces and providing cover for the UNSC Frigates and Marathon-Class vessels while they get in range to start pounding the opposing force with MAC blasts. Well, dandy. I made a battle plan. But what about the ENEMY force? Specs? Vessels? Weapons? Tech? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 [quote name='Mako109' timestamp='1346814378' post='6019434'] No need to narrow it. I was just wondering. [/quote] I'm definitely changing it to just Earth Federation, Energy Nede (the equivalent of Precursors to Star Ocean) can tank a universe buster. Let's narrow it to UNSC and Covenant vs, Earth Federation. There's a bunch of tech stuff in the game's dictionary (see section V. Miscellaneous in this FAQ [url="http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps2/536705-star-ocean-till-the-end-of-time/faqs/34190"]http://www.gamefaqs....time/faqs/34190[/url]) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Compiled all of it, and holy Hell is the UNSC in trouble... Even with the Covenant this may be a stomp. [spoiler='Energy'] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Energy Magnitude (Scientific Term)[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]A unit created to express huge amounts of energy on the universal scale, with magnitude 1 defined as the average total amount of energy emitted by a star approximately the same size as Sol in one microsecond (millionth of a second). In this notation, the amount of energy expressed goes up by a factor of one thousand with each magnitude, so the energy indicated by magnitude 9 is one septillion (10 24) times the amount of energy indicated by magnitude 1.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Creation Energy (Scientific Term) Research on this completely new type of energy system began after a discovery in the second half of the 4th century SD, and practical applications based on the system first appeared in the first half of the 8th century SD. This system, which was discovered in an ancient ruin on the planet Milokeenia, describes a system wherein part of the energy that exists in imaginary number space is drawn into three-dimensional space. Theoretically, this type of system could produce an essentially infinite amount of energy.Of course, since no type of material or electromagnetic shield can withstand the tremendous amounts of energy created by this system, the use of creation energy is strictly limited to special areas of space surrounded by space-time displacement shields. [/spoiler][/font] [spoiler='Ships'] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Battle-Class Ship (Ship) [/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]The latest model of battle spaceship, used as the backbone of the Pangalactic Federation military. Since battleships are built out of carbonic neotide, which as extremely high light beam absorption characteristics, they boast stealth characteristics that are dramatically superior to those of other ship classes. Battleships are approximately 300 meters long, sport a variety of armaments such as creation cannons, phase cannons, and quantum torpedoes, and are extremely versatile. Also, battleships are designed with the capability to simultaneously fire out of multiple gun ports, for overwhelming firepower that goes beyond what one would ordinarily believe possible. Battleships are also fully equipped from a defense standpoint, and are able to block up to 2.94 x 10-8% units of energy by using a sympathetic vibration effect between two onboard space-time displacement shields. These high-quality shields are manufactured by Ostin Manufacturing, which as the best reputation of any manufacturer in the Pangalactic Federation.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Combat Explorer (Ship)[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]A large vessel of approximately one kilometer in length built to explore uncharted regions of space outside the Pangalactic Federation's sphere of influence. These ships often embark on extended voyages of several months to several years at a time, so are designed to operate independently and handle any task alone, including combat.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Corsair (Ship) Of the large space ships used in the Milky Way, this type is designed with extra emphasis on maneuverability. Although corsairs cannot turn as sharply as battle-class ships, they are very good at accelerating and decelerating. They are much larger than battleships, but since they can sport large creation engines, they are slightly faster when traveling at their maximum warp speed.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Cutter (Ship) A ship designed purely for maneuverability with superb acceleration, deceleration, and turn radius characteristics. The major drawback of a Cutter is that the interior is almost entirely taken up by the Gravitic warp engine and creation engine, so there's not much room left for living in space. [/spoiler][/font] [spoiler='Weapons'] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Phase Cannon (Weapon)[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]A large-scale phase gun used on ships. These cannons used to be the mainstay of ship-to-ship weaponry on Federation ships, but after more powerful antimatter cannons and creation cannons were developed, they fell out of favor. However, as phase cannons require less energy than antimatter cannons and creation cannons, and can fire rapidly, they are still used as secondary weapons on many ships.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Antimatter Torpedo (Weapon) A weapon used before the quantum torpedo was perfected, consisting of a gigantic railgun that shoots a torpedo filled with both matter and antimatter deuterium through subspace. The torpedo returns to ordinary space a set period of time after launch, and creates an explosive force directed against its target when the antimatter and matter come together.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Quantum Torpedo (Weapon) An anti-ship weapon that slips quietly through subspace, then uses a gravitic warp drive to strike its target at faster-than-light speeds. This torpedo emits creation energy at the instant It reaches its target coordinates, thereby offering more stealth and destructive power than the older antimatter torpedo technology.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Creation Cannon (Weapon) The creation energy-based cannons used by ships in the Pangalactic Federation military. Since these guns use creation energy as an energy source, they are far more destructive than the antimatter cannons that used to be the mainstay of ship-to-ship weaponry. However, creation cannons are far more difficult to control. In 732 SD, the time-space displacement shield inside the battleship Tilgrem's primary cannon malfunctioned, resulting in an explosion that annihilated an entire planet from this universe! For this reason, Federation law stipulates extremely severe restrictions regarding the use of creation cannons.[/spoiler][/font] [spoiler='Shields'] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Electromagnetic Shield (EMS) (Technology Name)[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]A shield system that utilizes powerful radiation to form layers of gravitons in any desired location. This system uses the phenomenon whereby energy that is continuously fed into a certain closed space creates matter and gravitons to be formed, in order to create an antigravity field as well as a physical force field. When this type of shield is used in a battle situation, this frequency of the radiation used to generate the shield is randomly changed with each deployment. This prevents the enemy from matching the frequency of the shield and disabling it. It takes a tremendous amount of energy to deploy this kind of shield, so energy for this purpose must be stored somewhere in advance. Of course, there are limits to the space available, so it is not wise to deploy a shield that is more powerful (and which requires more space) than necessary. In combat, the timing at which the shield must be activated is unpredictable, so a number of thin energy fields are deployed outside the shield proper, and the shield is only activated when the fields are breached.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Space-Time Displacement Shield (Technology Name) A completely new type of force field that began to be researched when creation energy was first discovered. Unlike previous energy fields comprised of electromagnetic radiation, this field blocks energy in the fourth dimension by actually interfering with space-time itself, preventing it from conveying the energy.In other words, whereas previous shields could only block the target enemy type, space-time displacement shields actually reflect the energy into another dimension. This is why this new type of shield can block magnitudes more energy than previously utilized shields such as electromagnetic shields. [/spoiler][/font] [spoiler='Communication and Travel'] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Warp Speed (Scientific Term)[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]One method of expressing faster-than-light speeds. This unit represents the relative distance traveled in normal space during a set amount of time. This unit does not refer to actual speed at all, but rather to the distance between the measured start coordinate and measured end coordinate in normal space. When the actual distance an object has moved at warp speed is measured, it is always 2N-1 times the distance traveled by light in normal space.[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Subspace Warp (Scientific Term)[/font] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]A technology developed by Professor Trillas Bachtein in the year 2087 AD, and used by Earth as its first faster-than-light method of travel between the stars. While the ship actually travels slower than lightspeed, by wrapping the ship in multiple layers of subspace it is possible to sent the ship to locations faster than light can travel in ordinary space. This war technology was in widespread use before the development of gravitic warp navigation, but nowadays, it is only used by small vessels with less powerful engines.[/font] Gravitic Communication (Scientific Term) An extremely long-distance, high-speed communication system used primarily between stars. This system simultaneously uses an altspace warping effect to create signals and a Gravitic warp to enable communication at a speed that would have been unthinkable before the SD era. Gravitic Warp (Scientific Term) A new warp theory developed by Dr. Krupp in 537 SD, which enabled travel at speeds that greatly exceed those previously possible via subspace warp. The system works by controlling the gravitational dimension that ordinarily propagates through altspace and using it to directly warp space in front of the ship, compressing it in such a way as to effectively enable extremely high-speed travel through three- dimensional space. Almost all large vessels nowadays utilize gravitic warp systems. [/spoiler] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Well, I'm assuming that this is a Japanese game. And based on previous experiences, they don't exactly try to make things semi-realistic, something I think Halo does very well. While the Federation thingy is using ancient alien tech or whatever to turn their battles in their favor, the UNSC uses technology forged from their own bloodline and hundreds of years of research, and they STILL manage to win against several alien races teamed up against them. But yeah. Not really comparable, since their is also a HUGE time AND technological gap between the two games. Halo is set in the mid-26th century, while Star Ocean is set in SD whatever. I think that Starcraft and Halo would be a bit more comparable, due to the similar technology and time setting. In any case, 3,000 tons of Tungsten at 1/4 the speed of light? I don't care what fancy-shmancy alien stuff you're using. You = Toast. :3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 True, Star Ocean 3 is set in about A.D. 2809. Well, at least I got some research on Star Ocean and Halo out of it... Thanks for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 No problem. The Halo Wikia gets all the credit. It's very detailed about everything UNSC, and sort of for the Covanent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 3,000 tons at 1/4 the speed of light really is impressive though, how exactly didn't they turn the Covenant ships into donuts in the first encounter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Well, they are normally put in space with a space station built around it. So you can assume they're hard to turn. Because of their size and them needing a ground-based power plant to decrease the reload speed, they are very rarely mounted onto ships. And, like witnessed in one of the first battles above Earth, small boarding pods are able to EASILY avoid the Super-MAC blasts and board the stations, taking them out from the inside out. If it were strictly Ship-based combat, though, the Covies would be toast. A Super-MAC blast can cut clean through a Covie ship...and through the one behind it...and cripple the third behind the second. Normal MACs, the ones mounted on most, if not all, UNSC ships, are only 600 tons at 30,000 meters per second. A whopping blow, for sure, but not NEARLY as powerful, with a several minute reload time, and are still vulnerable to boarding pods. ...I just remembered. The UNSC [i]do[/i] have NOVA Bombs... "The only documented triggering of a NOVA Bomb occurred when it was accidentally detonated by a group of [url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Huragok"]Huragok[/url] stationed on the Covenant [i][url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Sublime_Transcendence"]Sublime Transcendence[/url][/i]. Immediately after [url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Kwassass"]Kwassass[/url], a fellow crew member, deciphered Admiral Whitcomb's message, the Huragok, through their curiosity and frenzied obsession, fixed the circuitry of the bomb, detonating it despite [url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Kwassass"]Kwassass[/url]'s attempts to stop them. The Huragok completed the detonation timer's circuit, which promptly resulted in its activation. The resulting explosion occurred between a Covenant outpost planet [url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Joyous_Exultation"]Joyous Exultation[/url] and its moon, [url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Malhiem"]Malhiem[/url], scorching half of the planet and shattering the moon. The resulting winds on Joyous Exultation flattened cities and spawned tidal waves. Radiation flooded the planet and killed everything living on it, penetrating the surface of the planet to its core. Every ship within the NOVA Bomb's range, save for those on the opposite side of the planet, boiled and vaporized in an instant. It is unknown what the Covenant did with the planet, but it is no longer capable of supporting life.[sup][url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/NOVA_Bomb#cite_note-1"][2][/url][/sup] The NOVA Bomb explosion completely destroyed three-fifths of the fleet that was there, totaling over 300 ships. Eighteen Destroyers, two Cruisers, one Carrier and the Flagship [i][url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Incorruptible"]Incorruptible[/url][/i] escaped the NOVA Bomb explosion due to a [url="http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Slipstream_Space"]Slipspace[/url] jump [i]en masse[/i] just seconds prior to the explosion. Other ships arrived to reinforce the [i]Incorruptible[/i] arrived from Joyous Exultation, suggesting that they escaped the bomb's detonation as a result of being positioned on the opposite side of the planet. The novel describes the explosion as though 'a small star erupted between Joyous Exultation and its moon.' " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Youch. Based on the tech though, any lower than a NOVA bomb won't even [i]reach[/i] the Federation's ships before getting phase-shifted to another dimension. They'd probably be like "they have [i]balistic weapons!? Hahahahahahaha!"[/i] I certainly wouldn't have made this topic if I knew there was such a huge disparity. Do the UNSC even have shields? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Well, it depends on whether the Fed's know the capabilities of a NOVA. If they don't they might be oblivious to the rather small object, then vaporized. If they do know, however, it'd be pretty easy to avoid. The only instances of shielding possessed by the UNSC I know of would be personal shielding used my SPARTANS, but that doesn't count. It's all metal, baby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 How many NOVAs are there? They sound kind of expensive... They may be caught off guard, but there's no way they'd keep falling for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 They are capable of making many of them. Just not at a mass-produced scale, due to the Billions and Billions of human lives lost due to the War. ...Unless this forgets the war and has the Covies and Humans team up right off the bat. Then there would be SO MANY MORE forces, technologies, and weapons at their disposal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Alright. I did some digging on Halo Wiki and Star Ocean calcs. As speculated here [quote] Assumptions: the moon is 2 km, and the NOVA bomb is only 5,000 km away. Calc: Apply the Inverse Squared Law: Source Energy / (4 * Pi * R[sup]2[/sup]) the radius is the distance from the source to the range. x/ (4 * 3.14195... * 5,000[sup]2[/sup]) = 4 Megatons per square kilometer to fragment a 2 km moon which requires 8 Megatons to be fragmented. x = 1.2 Petatons. [/quote] NOVA bombs have an approximate yield of 1200000000000000 tons. according to the game, Creation Cannons are Magnitude 2, clocking them at about (based on the Sun's energy output) 9510000000000 tons Which means, in terms of absolute firepower (though not prevalence) Halo's best weapon has Star Ocean beat by ~126 times. Still, since the UNSC ships are basically just metal, the Federation's lightspeed Quantum Torpedoes should rip them apart before they can do anything. No shields might cut it against the Covenant, but not here. [i]Oh well, at least the topic's cool from a Sci-Fi standpoint.[/i] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 For what the UNSC has for the years their behind, plus a lack of fancy alien stuff, they are dang impressive. But yes, Star Ocean wins. But take away your alien tech and what do you have? A navy of cottonballs floating around hopelessly. :3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 [quote name='Mako109' timestamp='1346883599' post='6019795'] For what the UNSC has for the years their behind, plus a lack of fancy alien stuff, they are dang impressive. But yes, Star Ocean wins. But take away your alien tech and what do you have? A navy of cottonballs floating around hopelessly. :3 [/quote] Well, Star Ocean stuck with Creation Energy when they found it because it was epic. If they didn't find it, I'm sure they still would have improved over time, maybe more, or maybe less, than the UNSC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makο Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Imagine if the UNSC decided to pursue and use Forerunner and Precurser tech. I think the odds would be FAR more even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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