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Is this OP'd? [Level Flux]

DoomBeast

By DoomBeast
in Experimental Archive

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Bahamut - Envoy of the End Newbie

Bahamut - Envoy of the End

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Posted

[quote name='AggroDrago' timestamp='1319987134' post='5607457']
No, I would disagree. There are cards that are similar in nature to this, I don't this it's OPed, I think it's the only card of its kind worth running.
[/quote]

How many OCG/TCG cards can you name that let you increase the level of any one monster that you might ever control by 3, never mind two of them?

(Has already looked at Wiki and knows he's safe.)

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Agro Newbie

Agro

Posted
Posted

[quote name='Verz Bahamut' timestamp='1319987689' post='5607484']

How many OCG/TCG cards can you name that let you increase the level of any one monster that you might ever control by 3, never mind two of them?

(Has already looked at Wiki and knows he's safe.)
[/quote]There are cards that change level all the time, maybe not 2 monsters at the same time, but if he weren't trying to make a card that's new, what's the point of making cards at all? And this card isn't anymore broken than Tour Guide itself is anyhow.

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Bahamut - Envoy of the End Newbie

Bahamut - Envoy of the End

Posted
Posted

[quote name='AggroDrago' timestamp='1319987778' post='5607487']
There are cards that change level all the time, maybe not 2 monsters at the same time, but if he weren't trying to make a card that's new, what's the point of making cards at all? And this card isn't anymore broken than Tour Guide itself is anyhow.
[/quote]

... and 99% of them either bring the level down, to a fixed number, or level to a monster with a different level. Even in the anime I don't think I've seen anything that gains anything more than 1 level (Gagaga Magician aside).

I don't have a problem with creating new effects and ideas, far from it (does this really count as new though?) but I think being able to take any two monsters and be able to turn them into practically any card in your extra deck that you need at that moment, at the drop of a hat, for nothing, just isn't balanced.

As for that last argument...

[b]Monster Super Reborn[/b]
[color=#008080][b]Spell[/b][/color]
Special Summon 1 monster from your Graveyard. It gains 1500 ATK, and is unaffected by Trap Cards.

Well at least it's not as broken as BLS...

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Althemia Newbie

Althemia

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Posted

[quote name='DoomBeast' timestamp='1319989416' post='5607533']
'Cause Bahamut.
[/quote]

No-one would run this either way simply because it takes up space from a deck that really just doesn't need it. Using Bahamut's logic though, Resonance Device is broke because it makes a LIGHT Machine-Type the same level as CyDra and it can go into Volcasaurus. Honestly, just don't listen to the argument that Bahamut is presenting. It'll be fine without the discard cost.

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Bahamut - Envoy of the End Newbie

Bahamut - Envoy of the End

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Posted

[quote name='Nu-13' timestamp='1319989530' post='5607536']
No-one would run this either way simply because it takes up space from a deck that really just doesn't need it. Using Bahamut's logic though, Resonance Device is broke because it makes a LIGHT Machine-Type the same level as CyDra and it can go into Volcasaurus. Honestly, just don't listen to the argument that Bahamut is presenting. It'll be fine without the discard cost.
[/quote]

What?

Where did I say all cards that increase the levels of monsters are broke? Resonance sure as hell isn't broke because it requires set conditions; ie two monsters of the same type and attribute. Playing something like the aforementioned SS Cyber Dragon + NS Cyber Proto + Resonance = Volcasaurus is a fine combination.

My problem with this is you can take ANY two monsters (providing they're the same level to start with, obviously not as difficult condition as Resonance) and make pretty much ANY Xyz.

The effect is just too vague and too bendable to be convenient.

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Althemia Newbie

Althemia

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Posted

[quote name='Verz Bahamut' timestamp='1319990605' post='5607559']
What?

Where did I say all cards that increase the levels of monsters are broke? Resonance sure as hell isn't broke because it requires set conditions; ie two monsters of the same type and attribute. Playing something like the aforementioned SS Cyber Dragon + NS Cyber Proto + Resonance = Volcasaurus is a fine combination.

My problem with this is you can take ANY two monsters (providing they're the same level to start with, obviously not as difficult condition as Resonance) and make pretty much ANY Xyz.

The effect is just too vague and too bendable to be convenient.
[/quote]

You're saying Level Modulation as a whole is a problem because apparently you can make high Rank Xyzs with this, when this isn't even worth running in the first place. I mean seriously, I could only see around 2~3 decks being able to run this at all, one of which this is only a side option for.

Also, you can't make an Xyz. Chances are you will most probably not be able to make a Rank 10 from this, or Thunder-End. Or anything that requires 4 materials, perhaps. Even so, this isn't broken. Most of the time, what you're suggest is broken is how quickly you're able to get to monsters of the same Level out onto the field, but even so it's situational that you'll have this in hand without it clogging.

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Ieyasu Tokugawa Newbie

Ieyasu Tokugawa

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Posted

[quote name='Verz Bahamut' timestamp='1319990605' post='5607559']
My problem with this is you can take ANY two monsters (providing they're the same level to start with, obviously not as difficult condition as Resonance) and make pretty much ANY Xyz.
[/quote]
[img]http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110822173328/yugioh/images/thumb/4/49/GagagaMagicianGENF-EN-SR-1E.png/300px-GagagaMagicianGENF-EN-SR-1E.png[/img]
[img]http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110918083305/yugioh/images/f/f5/GagagaGirlORCS-JP.jpg[/img]

Gagaga Girl is officially broke it seems.

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Bahamut - Envoy of the End Newbie

Bahamut - Envoy of the End

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Posted

[quote name='Twilight Sparkle' timestamp='1319991175' post='5607574']
[img]http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110822173328/yugioh/images/thumb/4/49/GagagaMagicianGENF-EN-SR-1E.png/300px-GagagaMagicianGENF-EN-SR-1E.png[/img]
[img]http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110918083305/yugioh/images/f/f5/GagagaGirlORCS-JP.jpg[/img]

Gagaga Girl is officially broke it seems.
[/quote]

That's a fair enough argument to diffuse mine I guess. I'll admit defeat to that.

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Bahamut - Envoy of the End Newbie

Bahamut - Envoy of the End

Posted
Posted

Probably gonna regret coming back to this but... Speed Spell - Tune Up 123?

Look I put my argument badly when I first saw and (over)reacted to this card. It's probably not overpowered like I immediately thought, for the reasons highlighted by some but not all of the above posters.

However what I still find a problem with this card and what made me dislike it (and make me wrongly think it was overpowered maybe) is that it involves too little input thought behind it. I mean take Resonance, you have to think up little combos on how best to use it. Example: Summoner Monk > Gagaga Magician > Raise Gagagas Level > Resonance = Big Eye or whatever. SS Cyber Proto > Hell Reckless > Cyber Dragon x2 > Resonance = HMK Daboku Zaku. I love thinking up this little combinations regardless if they are great or not, because its rewarding when one works. This requires no real thought at all. Dunno if you'll understand what I'm driving at here but that's what I think.

It is splashable (I appreaciate I'm in the minority regarding that), and I just find the nature of its effect a bit too user friendly, a bit too convenient and a bit too uninvolving. Doubt that makes sense but that's what I think.

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Agro Newbie

Agro

Posted
Posted

[quote name='Verz Bahamut' timestamp='1320002654' post='5608028']
Probably gonna regret coming back to this but... Speed Spell - Tune Up 123?

Look I put my argument badly when I first saw and (over)reacted to this card. It's probably not overpowered like I immediately thought, for the reasons highlighted by some but not all of the above posters.

However what I still find a problem with this card and what made me dislike it (and make me wrongly think it was overpowered maybe) is that it involves too little input thought behind it. I mean take Resonance, you have to think up little combos on how best to use it. Example: Summoner Monk > Gagaga Magician > Raise Gagagas Level > Resonance = Big Eye or whatever. SS Cyber Proto > Hell Reckless > Cyber Dragon x2 > Resonance = HMK Daboku Zaku. I love thinking up this little combinations regardless if they are great or not, because its rewarding when one works. This requires no real thought at all. Dunno if you'll understand what I'm driving at here but that's what I think.

It is splashable (I appreaciate I'm in the minority regarding that), and I just find the nature of its effect a bit too user friendly, a bit too convenient and a bit too uninvolving. Doubt that makes sense but that's what I think.
[/quote]Tour Guide is the problem here, and Summoner monk. Hm... Maybe limit the level of the monsters you can select.

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