Ho-oh Vs. Lugia

[Ghost-O]

Because a large number of the Uber meta-game isn't physical?

[Zexaeon]

Aeroblast is 100 BP. Which doesn't matter at all because Lugia's SpA, once again, sucks. It would be good if Lugia was OU, but its sub-par in Ubers. And the abundance of Specially Defensive beasts in Ubers (including Ho-Oh) make anything Lugia could do completely irrelevant unless it uses Calm Mind.

 

Sacred Fire, on the other hand, is a good attacking type, is physical, and inflicts a Burn 50% of the time. And for those of you who don't know this, Burns cripple the Atk stat of whatever has it, meaning that physical threats like Groudon or Rayquaza can get completely nerfed by it.

 

In terms of Signature moves, Sacred Fire is way better than Aeroblast.

 

Also, SR is not as common in Ubers as it is in OU. Ho-Oh is also defensive enough to Roost off SR damage against most threats.

[Dark]

Ho-Oh' date=' its sexy and fire.

 

Pandorum, I'm sure it just revived them if I listened to the story in Ecruteak correct.

[/quote']

 

Thats what i thought, also there signature moves Aeroblast and Sacred Fire are just as cool as there owners, but i think Aeroblast is cooler with the Critical hit chance.

 

50% Burn Chance > Critical Hit

 

I'd rather kill than let it live with a status problem.

 

You know what Aeroblast would be able to kill?

 

[insert generic bad Grass-type with low SpD] and [insert generic bad Pokemon]

 

What's it's base power? Don't feel like checking. And I'd rather run Lugia than Ho-Oh because of the abundant use of Stealth Rock.

 

95, iirc. So after STAB, you are looking at 142 Base Power. But that is coming off of a 90 base SpA (again, iirc), which is pretty bad for Uber material. And unless you have some Calm Minds with you, you aren't going to be 2HKOing much. Furthermore, it only has 8 PP max, which is really reduced to 4 after you account for 9001 Ubers having Pressure. And it doesn't hit anything super-effectively except... Shaymin-S. If you want an awesome Shaymin-S counter, +1 Lugia with Aeroblast is totally your guy!

 

Because a large number of the Uber meta-game isn't physical?

 

True, but residual damage is always nice, and it's coming off of an amazing high ATK stat with STAB.

[Zexaeon]

Bish, I beat you to the punch. >=P

[Ghost-O]

Ho-Oh' date=' its sexy and fire.

 

Pandorum, I'm sure it just revived them if I listened to the story in Ecruteak correct.

[/quote']

 

Thats what i thought, also there signature moves Aeroblast and Sacred Fire are just as cool as there owners, but i think Aeroblast is cooler with the Critical hit chance.

 

50% Burn Chance > Critical Hit

 

I'd rather kill than let it live with a status problem.

 

You know what Aeroblast would be able to kill?

 

[insert generic bad Grass-type with low SpD] and [insert generic bad Pokemon]

 

What's it's base power? Don't feel like checking. And I'd rather run Lugia than Ho-Oh because of the abundant use of Stealth Rock.

 

95, iirc. So after STAB, you are looking at 142 Base Power. But that is coming off of a 90 base SpA (again, iirc), which is pretty bad for Uber material. And unless you have some Calm Minds with you, you aren't going to be 2HKOing much. Furthermore, it only has 8 PP max, which is really reduced to 4 after you account for 9001 Ubers having Pressure. And it doesn't hit anything super-effectively except... Shaymin-S. If you want an awesome Shaymin-S counter, +1 Lugia with Aeroblast is totally your guy!

 

Because a large number of the Uber meta-game isn't physical?

 

True' date=' but residual damage is always nice, and it's coming off of an amazing high ATK stat with STAB.

[/quote']

 

But there are a decent number of physical Ubers in the meta-game was my point. The fact that the burn chance is high and has a better chance of reducing attack makes it more likely to be used than Aero Blast.

[Dark]

Bish' date=' I beat you to the punch. >=P

[/quote']

 

stfu up D:<

 

But there are a decent number of physical Ubers in the meta-game was my point. The fact that the burn chance is high and has a better chance of reducing attack makes it more likely to be used than Aero Blast.

 

Yeah, but the Uber metagame is mainly special-based.

[Zexaeon]

It's not about quantity, it's about quality.

 

In this case, Sacred Fire is extremely valuable because it can cripple Rayquaza, Garchomp, Groudon, physical Palkia, and any other physical threat.

 

While Physical Sweepers may be few in Ubers, the ones that ARE there are generally considered top-tier threats. So it doesn't matter how few they are - Sacred Fire is a great check for them,

[Aximil]

I stick by my argument.

Lugia can learn Psychic' date=' the most overpowered move there is. Oh, wow, I can control anything you do instantly and control your attacks to send them back at you. Pretty sure Ho-Oh can learn it too, but oh well.[/quote']

[Zexaeon]

That's an anime definition of what psychic does. And it's very inconsistent.

[Lonk]

Ho-oh is a deity that is capable of reviving the dead

 

Lugia is powerful and there is a bunch of them

 

and as the saying goes:

 

Deity>Extremely Powerful commanders

[Dark]

There is only one Lugia in my game. Is it broken or something? <_

[bobtheman]

Ho-oh

[Saturn of Elemia]

Lugia

[Mr. Judgment Dragon]

^ Lugia sucks with water moves. Your reasoning is completely and totally fail.

 

Ho-Oh can destroy Lugia. All it needs is one move.

 

Lugia can't learn Electric Attacks now? Deserves to be mentioned although they're rather uncommon on it. Still' date=' Lugia at least needs Toxic or a decently powered Super Effective Attack to actually bring Ho-oh down. Even though Lugia can stall Sacred Fire out, it can't do the same to Brave Bird but with Toxic, Brave Bird recoil and even Life Orb recoil, Ho-oh won't last against it.

 

I stick by my argument.

Lugia can learn Psychic' date=' the most overpowered move there is. Oh, wow, I can control anything you do instantly and control your attacks to send them back at you. Pretty sure Ho-Oh can learn it too, but oh well.[/quote']

 

Psychic is a crap attacking type. Sure it was ridiculous in Gen I, it is so pathetic you should almost never use it unless it is STABed but in Ubers, Super Effective coverage is more important than STAB in most cases (the sheer power of Ho-oh's Brave Bird makes it viable enough and while Fire may not be the best Attacking Type in Ubers, it isn't the worst either and the 50% chance of Burning something is too good to pass up so even if a Pokemon resists it, it can still mess stuff like Garchomp and Physical Rayquaza up). Too many Ubers and Pokemon used in Ubers resist it or worse yet carry an immunity to it so therefore it is pretty much pointless to use. Even in OU the same could be said in some cases but that ultimately depends on said Pokemon's movepool. For example, Starmie doesn't need it since it has a better STAB in Water which helps deter Tyranitar and other Pursuit users like Scizor and Weavile although they aren't OHKOed by them so they can still put Starmie in a tough spot if they get in undamaged as well as Thunderbolt, Ice Beam and even Grass Knot if needed. Psychic while strong with STAB would just hinder it more than it would help it.

 

tl;dr: It would depend on what moveset and moves they run considering their rather wide movepools.

[Zexaeon]

True, FD, on all counts. My only point was that only needs Toxic to defeat Lugia - if they both Toxic each other, Ho-Oh will outstall Lugia thanks to Lugia having larger HP (a hindrance in this case, due to the pile-up of Toxic Percent damage), and once Lugia's HP is decreased by enough, Ho-Oh can use Brave Bird that turn, or even Sacred Fire, and let the Toxic Damage finish Lugia off.

 

Lugia will usually outspeed most Ho-Oh, in my experience, so it will take the hit after any Roosting.

 

But without Toxic, Ho-Oh will inevitably fall to Lugia. Unless Lugia ISN'T using Toxic for some reason.

 

Basically, Lugia loses unless it has Toxic. And then even if it does, Lugia still loses if Ho-Oh ALSO has Toxic. Toxic is a highly determinant move in deciding this matchup.

[venmon]

Lugia is white...

racism win

humanity fail

[tommers2008]

Ho-oh

[Lover Bat]

lugia kicks @$$. not because of areoblast or his water attacks, but with lugias sp defence, ho-ohs sacred fire sucks @$$.

 

once again lugia kicks @$$.

 

i vote for lugia

[~Marluxia~]

Ligia.

[Tentacruel]

Definitely Batman.

[Yang Xiao-Long]

Lugia. He's nicer to me in SoulSilver than Ho-Oh is. Ho-Oh just stares at me, like it didn't want to get caught by me and that darn dusk ball.

 

but yeah, Lugia owns. He actually gave me a challenge in his battle. Ho-Oh...ehhh...not so much.

[General Smiley]

Who cares who is stronger? My pichu pwns them both!

 

 

 

Still, I vote for Lugia.