The Pokemon Gentleman's Lounge

[Ghost-O]

Sounds good Dark' date=' just let me know when you cook something up.

 

=O I'm eager to experiment with this team, because it's another UU team that IS capable of playing in OU (I tend to make a lot of those, huh?).

 

Except unlike my other ones, this one actually has a couple OU swap-ins for playing *better* in OU.

[/quote']

 

I'm going to take a swing and guess three Pokemon you chose from OU.

 

Jolteon

Aerodactyl

Latios

[Zexaeon]

Nope~

 

Also, edited my last post for ya.

[Ghost-O]

Bah, I've never been a fan of Groudon. Despite owning an Adamant Groudon with 413 ATK, I don't have the feel to use him. But changes and suggestions to the Uber party are welcome. :)

 

I'll post the OU party I'm working on later.

[Dark]

To my knowledge, Latios is still Uber, with or without a Soul Dew.

 

And even though SR isn't too common in Ubers, if it is up Ho-oh gets buttraped. And carrying a spinner is a bit of a liability these days. The only viable one is Forretress (sp?), and pretty much any boosted, STAB, neutral special attack from something with a decent SpA will OHKO it. And Giratina is just... BIG AND LOOMING AND ULTRA-MEGA-SPIN-BLOCKER.

[Ghost-O]

That's why I have him. ;)

 

I've decided I may go ahead and swap Kyogre for Groudon. I'm still thinking on it, or I can drop Ho-Oh and throw in my bulky Mewtwo.

 

The OU:

 

Garchomp

Gengar

Gyarados

---

The big three Gs? Lol.

---

Infernape

Smeargle

Bronzong

 

Changes, questions, comments, and suggestions welcome, of course.

[Felix]

Garchomp is Uber, so bad luck there.

 

Maybe also tell us what you're planning on running them as.

[Ghost-O]

Garchomp is Uber' date=' so bad luck there.

 

Maybe also tell us what you're planning on running them as.

[/quote']

 

You mean by Sweeper and what not?

 

I could always take out Garchomp for Flygon / D-Nite / Tyranitar.

[Zexaeon]

Is Garchomp no longer Uber?

 

And yeah, SR can hurt Ho-Oh, but Roost does help stop that, and we must remember that Ho-oh is no glass canon, so it's not like it can't take a hit on a turn of roosting. Of course, this is also assuming you choose your target to switch into wisely.

 

Starmie, for all it's fragility, is an occasional Uber Spinner - it's fast, it can spin, and it can threaten Giratina's SpD (and especially Giratina-O's) with LO'd Shadow Balls (playing Starmie in Ubers without LO is stupid, since using it in the first place is only for those who really fear Stealth Rocks).

 

EDIT: Ah, so it is still Uber.

[Ghost-O]

I forgot that it was. So it can go for Tyranitar.

[Dark]

And yeah, SR can hurt Ho-Oh, but Roost does help stop that, and we must remember that Ho-oh is no glass canon, so it's not like it can't take a hit on a turn of roosting. Of course, this is also assuming you choose your target to switch into wisely.

 

Fair enough, but it's pretty dangerous having a Pokemon with 50% out. Because you have two options, really. Attack, or Roost. If you decide to Roost and the person predicts that, they have a free switch. If you switch your Ho-oh out, you'll have the same problem the next time you switch it in. If you attack, a good enough prediction will stop much damage, Brave Bird will just aid in KOing yourself, and if you KO something, they get a free switch and you'll have a 50% Ho-oh as a sitting duck. And if you switch out from Ho-oh, you are either dead or at 1% the next time you switch in. So it's a tough call, really.

 

And I have never seen Starmie in Ubers. Seriously, like never.

[Felix]

Actually Dark, if you're going to Roost then presumably you've predicted their switch, not the other way round.

[Dark]

Ehh, fair enough. That's assuming you switch into a Pokemon that cannot do 50% of damage to you.

[Zexaeon]

Bear in mind that the only users of 4X effective (Rock) type moves that can hurt Ho-Oh are physical sweepers. And they NEVER want to even attempt to switch in to Ho-Oh, thanks to Sacred Fire.

 

The threat of being Burned that easily (and damaged hard) is just too dire.

[Ghost-O]

In this case:

 

T-Tar: Adamant, Life Orb

EQ

Stone Edge

D-Dance

Crunch

 

Gyarados: Adamant, Leftovers

EQ

D-Dance

Waterfall

Ice Fang (formerly, Stone Edge, for fellow Gyarados and Zapdos)

 

Gengar: Timid, Choice Scarf

Shadow Ball

Thunderbolt

Focus Blast

Explosion

 

Infernape: Naive, Life Orb

Nasty Plot

Close Combat

Hidden Power Ice (it took SO many tries to get this)

Flamethrower

 

Smeargle: Jolly, Focus Sash

Spore

Spikes

Stealth Rock

Taunt

 

Bronzong: Brave, Macho Brace

Trick Room

Gyro Ball

Earthquake

Explosion

 

Thoughts?

[Felix]

TTar and a Pokemon with a Focus Sash? You should be ashamed.

 

You have no obvious lead, unless you were planning on suiciding Smeargle? Then I might forgive the first part. With suicides, type has bearly any significance, so there's much better Pokemon to do the job you want.

 

Also, WHY DOES YOUR BRONZOND HAVE TRICK ROOM ON A NONE TRICK ROOM TEAM?

 

Finally, what about EVs?

[Zexaeon]

Hey Felix, you good to battle today on wifi?

[Dark]

Bear in mind that the only users of 4X effective (Rock) type moves that can hurt Ho-Oh are physical sweepers. And they NEVER want to even attempt to switch in to Ho-Oh' date=' thanks to Sacred Fire.

 

The threat of being Burned that easily (and damaged hard) is just too dire.

[/quote']

 

Who uses Rock-type moves in Uber? I doubt anything can actually learn Stone Edge. D:

 

And while Ho-oh would never switch into these Pokemon, Water and Electric attacks are strong enough to do 50%, especially when they are coming from Uber SpA.

[Zexaeon]

Groudon can sue Stone Edge. So can Rayquaza, if I'm not mistaken.

 

As for the Special threat, Ho-Oh has high SpD, so even off of Uber SpA, it's unlikely to take 50% from most 2x effective attacks. Kyogre is a notable exception, both due to getting STAB and due to bringing rain with it, but Ho-Oh wouldn't switch in against Kyogre anyway.

 

Ho-Oh will likely be switching in to Sunlight, so water is immediately neutralized anyway. As for electric, there isn't a single Uber who gets STAB from Electric moves, so Ho-Oh only has to really be concerned with them if they're coming from Special Monsters like Mewtwo, Latios, or possibly Deoxys, though less likely.

[Ghost-O]

TTar and a Pokemon with a Focus Sash? You should be ashamed.

 

You have no obvious lead' date=' unless you were planning on suiciding Smeargle? Then I might forgive the first part. With suicides, type has bearly any significance, so there's much better Pokemon to do the job you want.

 

Also, WHY DOES YOUR BRONZOND HAVE TRICK ROOM ON A NONE TRICK ROOM TEAM?

 

Finally, what about EVs?

[/quote']

 

Smeargle is a spiker. Who might you guess is my lead? :/ I was thinking about Azelf, but, meh.

 

I'm going to move Bronzong around, probably to a Stealth Rocker Wall instead of Trick Room. I got him in a trade, so I've only just been raising him. I'm thinking, if I keep him:

 

Stealth Rock

Gyro Ball

Earthquake

Hypnosis / Explosion

 

I go by Smogon when it comes to Evs.

 

Tyranitar is 252 Atk, 252 Spe, 4 Hp

Gyarados is 252 Atk, 4 Def, 252 Spe

Gengar is 4 Def, 252 SpA, and 252 Spe

Smeargle is 4 Hp, 252 Def, 252 Spe

Infernape is 64 Atk, 252 SpA, 192 Spe

 

 

Bronzong I'm unsure about. Again, I received it in a trade, so I'm probably going to switch it out with Weavile / Electivire.

 

There's also my consideration of Seargle to Azelf, Bronzong to Curselax or Blissey.

[Dark]

Groudon can sue Stone Edge. So can Rayquaza' date=' if I'm not mistaken.

 

As for the Special threat, Ho-Oh has high SpD, so even off of Uber SpA, it's unlikely to take 50% from most 2x effective attacks. Kyogre is a notable exception, both due to getting STAB and due to bringing rain with it, but Ho-Oh wouldn't switch in against Kyogre anyway.

 

Ho-Oh will likely be switching in to Sunlight, so water is immediately neutralized anyway. As for electric, there isn't a single Uber who gets STAB from Electric moves, so Ho-Oh only has to really be concerned with them if they're coming from Special Monsters like Mewtwo, Latios, or possibly Deoxys, though less likely.

[/quote']

 

And I didn't even consider the fact that sunlight brings Thunder's accuracy down to 50%.

 

But that spurs another question: what does Ho-oh bring to the table that something else can't already do? If you wanted a physical attacker, you have Rayquaza and Garchomp calling to you. Ho-oh gets... Sacred Fire. That's pretty much the main use of this thing, to get STAB burning hax and to get STAB suicide Brave Bird. But why would you want to use it over a DDance 'Quaza or a Mixoxis?

[Ghost-O]

Milotic is Uber?

[Dark]

Milotic is UU, because it's really outclassed in OU by Vappy and maybe even 'Cune.

[Ghost-O]

I'm shocked, if I may be honest.

 

Also, I misread Mixoxis as Mixotic. Apologies.

[Dark]

Lol, it's okay.

 

This may be a total shock, but a Specs Max SpA Psycho Boost from a Deoxys-A can 2HKO a Mewtwo (counting the SpA lowering on the second turn).

[Zexaeon]

Ho-Oh brings to the table the third highest Atk stat in Ubers (tying with Garchomp), the second highest SpD in Ubers (just behind Deoxys-D and tying with Lugia), and fourth highest in the entire game for that matter, and two terrific STAB attacks that other Pokemon wish they could use.

 

Even without Sunlight, Sacred Fire hurts.

 

SpD out the wazoo makes it a great switch-in for non supereffective Special attacks (or even 2x ones in some cases).

 

It's HP is tied with Lugia's, and the pair are only outstripped in this field by Giratina(-O), Garchomp, Arceus, and Wobbufett. It's Def may be mid-level, but combined with that HP and Roost, it's not like it's going to go down with a tap or two.

 

It also brings fear to the table. No physical attacker in their right mind is going to switch into Ho-Oh unless they have no other choice or are feeling especially gutsy.

 

And why do you assume BB is suicidal? You realize SR is uncommon in Ubers, right? So it's not like it's going to be using the move at 50% HP.

 

 

So, why choose Ho-Oh over Mixoxis, or Rayquaza? Because while it may not be lightning fast like Deoxys or have as high an offense as Quaza, it's not going to go down in one good hit like they will.

 

Hell, Deoxys in any form except Defense practically dies if touched by a light breeze. Also because Ho-Oh's SpD is downright incredible is another reason to pick it over the other 2.

 

And of course the last reason to pick it over the other two is because in the absence of SR, Ho-Oh's one major weakness comes from a Pokemon that won't dare oppose it, and being teamed up with that same Pokemon will give it an advantage the likes of which Palkia gets from Kyogre.

 

 

So, in comparison to Deoxys or Rayquaza, the cons and pros are:

 

Cons:

 

Less brute force (Both pack a considerably more powerful punch).

Slower (By 5 points to Ray, much more to Oxys).

Less variety (Only a few good techniques to choose from).

 

Pros:

 

More Staying Power (including Special Walling).

Better typing (With as much Ice attacks and Psychic-swatting going on in Ubers, you think they have better typing than Ho-Oh?)

Lethal Attack options (Do not piss in the eye of Sacred Fire or Brave Bird. They'll blink)

Punishment (Not previous mentioned, but this a great attack to have to take advantage of Calm Mind users. And Ho-Oh is the strongest physical pokemon in Ubers who can use it)