The Big September 2009 "What if?" topic?

[iAmNateXero]

DSF should be banned because it turns mediocre plays into OTKs. CCV should be banned because of the level of control over the game it gives to the player who activates it first. Reborn should be banned because costless generic revival is bad for the game.

 

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win." Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short, Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed, incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[Guest Chaos Pudding]

DSF should be banned because it turns mediocre plays into OTKs. CCV should be banned because of the level of control over the game it gives to the player who activates it first. Reborn should be banned because costless generic revival is bad for the game.

 

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win." Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed, incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

I'm disappointed you feel that way. I would hope to think that a player such as yourself would support trying to make the game more strategic and skillful.

 

And I said generic costless "revival". If you want to debate my terminology, at least get it right.

[Kira the Savior]

Honestly they all deserve it but with mezuki limited COSR will probably not be too much of a problem if they decide to leave it, wich hopefully they won't because it deserves the ban all the same

[iAmNateXero]

DSF should be banned because it turns mediocre plays into OTKs. CCV should be banned because of the level of control over the game it gives to the player who activates it first. Reborn should be banned because costless generic revival is bad for the game.

 

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win." Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed, incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

I'm disappointed you feel that way. I would hope to think that a player such as yourself would support trying to make the game more strategic and skillful.

 

And I said generic costless "revival". If you want to debate my terminology, at least get it right.

But cant you seem, it is strategic. You've attacked your opponent and he or she is left with less then 1400 Damage. Why wouldn't you want to finish off your opponent. It eliminates the luck factor of a come back, and It brings the forgotten Burn factor to the meta. In my views, DSF was the best thing that happened to the TCG in a very long time.

 

Regardless if you limit it to only revival, its still a poor argument. Im fine with abuseable revivals like CotH and PB banned as long as some revival exist. This is the only way how.

[Guest Chaos Pudding]

DSF should be banned because it turns mediocre plays into OTKs. CCV should be banned because of the level of control over the game it gives to the player who activates it first. Reborn should be banned because costless generic revival is bad for the game.

 

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win." Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed, incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

I'm disappointed you feel that way. I would hope to think that a player such as yourself would support trying to make the game more strategic and skillful.

 

And I said generic costless "revival". If you want to debate my terminology, at least get it right.

But cant you seem, it is strategic. You've attacked your opponent and he or she is left with less then 1400 Damage. Why wouldn't you want to finish off your opponent. It eliminates the luck factor of a come back, and It brings the forgotten Burn factor to the meta. In my views, DSF was the best thing that happened to the TCG in a very long time.

 

Regardless if you limit it to only revival, its still a poor argument. Im fine with abuseable revivals like CotH and PB banned as long as some revival exist. This is the only way how.

 

It isn't stategic. It's abusive. Using your logic, CED + Sangan into Yata was strategic because it was the best move you could make.

 

A wide variety of themes and archetypes have balanced revival options. To keep a broken card just to support those without is stupid and irresponsable.

[iAmNateXero]

Your assuming that I have no boundaries to whats broken and whats not. There is nothing abusive of making a synchro. Ive stated many times that I do believe they should have been made harder to use, but who listens? As it is, DSF is fine, its a huge cannon soldier, and nothing is wrong with it.

 

Is it hard to belive that not all people play with themed decks? o.O

[Exiro]

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win."

 

The fact that this statement is true' date=' is exactly [i']why[/i] it should be banned.

 

 

Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

[/quote']

 

What exactly does 'good ideas' refer to?

 

 

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

That doesn't mean that OTKs that involve attacking aren't OTKs.

 

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed' date=' incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

Chaos Pudding didn't refer CCV to as "Generic Costless", nor is MR a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost, so I don't know what card you are talking about here.

 

 

DSF should be banned because it turns mediocre plays into OTKs. CCV should be banned because of the level of control over the game it gives to the player who activates it first. Reborn should be banned because costless generic revival is bad for the game.

 

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win." Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed, incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

I would hope to think that a player such as yourself would support trying to make the game more strategic and skillful.

 

Wait, why exactly is whatever he is supporting not the same as trying to make the game more strategic and skillful? Since when don't people need arguments anymore?

[Guest Chaos Pudding]

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win."

 

The fact that this statement is true' date=' is exactly [i']why[/i] it should be banned.

 

 

Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

[/quote']

 

What exactly does 'good ideas' refer to?

 

 

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

That doesn't mean that OTKs that involve attacking aren't OTKs.

 

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed' date=' incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

Chaos Pudding didn't refer CCV to as "Generic Costless", nor is MR a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost, so I don't know what card you are talking about here.

 

 

DSF should be banned because it turns mediocre plays into OTKs. CCV should be banned because of the level of control over the game it gives to the player who activates it first. Reborn should be banned because costless generic revival is bad for the game.

 

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win." Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed, incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

I would hope to think that a player such as yourself would support trying to make the game more strategic and skillful.

 

Wait, why exactly is whatever he is supporting not the same as trying to make the game more strategic and skillful? Since when don't people need arguments anymore?

 

Not banning DSF != Skillful.

[werewolfjedi]

will you two stop it.

generic costless revival is better than abuse-able revival, or instant interrupting revival.

 

they would have to make non generic revival for everything just so that monster reborn isn't needed, that would take up nearly an entire pack by itself.

in addition, if they just removed it completely, then only a few deck types could revive at all, mostly just zombies and spellcasters, and the later are getting more and more segmented support, to such a point that it is becoming an encroaching storm of doom if anyone can make a deck that even halfway works in combing them. now you want to add to the fact they are one of the few deck types that can revive, and not only that, but do it easily? not smart.

 

on the dsf front, it has too much ATK, that is the tipping factor for the card, it it's attack had been 2400, then the problem could be avoided, even if just barely. in addition, it has no limitations on it's synchro components, making it another card to be abused just like goyo.

that fact that is can otk on turn 2, and all you need are 2 spells and 1 summon priest (and cat and another priest in your deck.). a one card otk with a setup cost of any two spells is not skill, it's abuse.

the card that actually deals all the damage, dsf, should be removed, because then is allows summon priest, rescue cat, and airibelum to all be left alone, allowing for more creative play. the banning of cat, or the limiting of priest to 1, would also stop the combo, but it would remove creativity from the game, as then all the players left without the cat otk would look for a new way to complete the otk.

and they have 5 card slots left to do it with.

so then dsf becomes the problem.

it must be banned, as 1 still allows the otk to work, even if it is harder to pull off.

but not that much harder.

blackwings are just as able to abuse dsf as cat synchro, and their ENTIRE THEME is swarming the field, which is exactly what dsf needs.

all they need is a bit more on the field, and dsf otk becomes capable for blackwings.

 

and vayu is giving them that. the only thing that is needed is more levels, and vayu gives them that.

 

p.s. yata lock does take skill, as idiots who try it on me are always stopped, since witch and sangan don't escape my notice without dieing before CED hits the field.

[iAmNateXero]

Not going for DSF is almost as dumb as saying "Im not playing to win."

 

The fact that this statement is true' date=' is exactly [i']why[/i] it should be banned.

No. The Fact this statement is true proves the game is evolving. We are no longer confined to all Attacking OTK's or all Burn OTK's. We live in an the game was always intended for Agro Burn, and DSF is the embodiment of such concept.

 

Im sorry if nobody wants to be smart about playing a child's card game. In short' date=' Good Ideas =/= Ban hammer.

[/quote']

 

What exactly does 'good ideas' refer to?

The Idea of securing a Victory.

 

People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttackotksaren'ttheonlyotksanymore" Well tough.

 

That doesn't mean that OTKs that involve attacking aren't OTKs.

You misinterpreted what I said. I made it too unclear so Ill restate it. People are just not adapting well to the "LOLAttack only otks aren't the only otks anymore".

 

 

Finally I want to touch your "Generic Costless" argument. I am really tired of reading this tired spoon feed' date=' incorrect statement. Am I assuming you are against all things Generic and Costless? if so, they Heavy storm deserves the ban hammer too correct? As does Dark Dust spirit (keeping in mind game mechanics aren't cost.) So with this mind frame, how can you condemn a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost?

[/quote']

 

Chaos Pudding didn't refer CCV to as "Generic Costless", nor is MR a slow trap with a limited Monster Destruction effect with a cost, so I don't know what card you are talking about here.

Those two words is what describes Monster reborn and others like POG and should just be stricken from all conversations. If you are going to use it in an argument be about all of it, not part of it.

[RyanAtlus]

BTW: what about Gale?

1 or 2?

[Flame Dragon]

All of them should be banned, but if it's which needs it most it's:

 

DSF/CCV (to hard to call)

Reborn

CoSR

[Insert_Name_Here]

All of them should be banned' date=' but if it's which needs it most it's:

 

DSF/CCV (to hard to call) [b']Ban them now[/b]

Reborn deserves to be at 1

CoSR dont care

Crush card may destroy an opponents deck, but may help your opponent if you are playing against Lightsworns

DSF ban him now, the ultimate LP drainer

Reborn need to stay

tthats all i have to say

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

All of them and many, many more.

[~/Coolio Prime\~]

All of these are banworthy, and Konami still missed a bunch.

[deathxy]

CCV must be banned

 

dark strike fighter is a burn deck by its own

 

monster its broken, but with COTH and premature, will stay at one

 

COSR is a draw engine, zombies abuses this card, so they limit zombies, its a balance, ban COSR and semi-limit mezuki and plague, or do nothing with this card

[Toffee.]

dark strike fighter is a burn deck by its own

 

I somewhat want to call lolycm on this...

But yea' date=' Strike Fighter bascily [i']IS[/i] a walking burn deck.

[BehindTheMask]

How many of you are gonna be Recruiter Chaos like me if this is real?

[RyanAtlus]

CCV 1

DSF 0

MR 1

COSR 1

 

Imagine...

on the cards from Turbo Pack, there is written:

THIS CARD CANNOT BE USED IN AN OFFICIAL DUEL

What opinion would that give you?

[DesCrow]

all should be banned honestly..

[Phantom Roxas]

I see, so you created an entirely separate topic rather than just suggesting that the owner of the other topic could just add a poll. INGENIOUS!

[RyanAtlus]

I see' date=' so you created an entirely separate topic rather than just suggesting that the owner of the other topic could just add a poll. INGENIOUS!

[/quote']

 

inowrite7

 

Except for the fact that what I actually wanted to discuss was the impact of the banlist on the meta.

[zelda_tp_fan]

o_0WTF0_o

[RyanAtlus]

o_0WTF0_o

 

I know.

But don't do whoopadeeboopadee in my topic.